The Assembly met at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.

I call Members to order.

Statement by the Llywydd

Before we move to today’s business, I want to mark the sad news announced over the weekend of the death of the former Member Rod Richards. He was the first leader of the Welsh Conservative group in the Assembly, having represented Clwyd North West as an MP in Westminster. He also had the privilege of being the first Assembly Member to take the oath in this Parliament. I’m sure that everyone will want to join me in extending sincerest condolences to Rod Richards’s family and friends at this difficult time. Thank you.

1. Questions to the First Minister

Questions to the First Minister is the first item on our agenda, and the first question is from Mohammad Asghar.

Recruiting Skilled Workers

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: 1. What action is the Welsh Government taking to ensure businesses in Wales can recruit the skilled workers they need? OAQ54239

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, we will deliver 100,000 apprenticeships in this Assembly term. We will deploy our flexible skills programme to support businesses, and we will continue to oppose migration policies from the UK Government that would deny those businesses access to the skilled workers they need.

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: Thank you for the reply, First Minister. The Open University business barometer, which monitors the skills landscape of the UK, shows that 92 per cent of organisations surveyed in Wales struggle to find workers with the right skills. Over 50 per cent said their organisation had struggled as a result of the skills shortage, and 64 per cent struggle to hire for a management or leadership position. They forecast the shortfall is now costing organisations here in Wales an extra £355 million a year in recruiting fees, inflated salaries, temporary staff, and training for workers hired at a lower level than intended. First Minister, what action are you and your Government taking, in light of this report, to help Welsh organisations to bridge the divide between the skills they need and the skills available in the labour market in Wales? Thank you.

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I agree of course—the importance of actions that Government can take to make sure that public services, businesses, have the skilled labour that they need. It's why the actions that this Government has taken have seen that, between 2011 and 2018, the percentage of working-age adults in Wales with no qualifications fell from 12 per cent to 8 per cent, and, over the same period, the percentage of working adults qualified at higher skills level rose from 32 per cent to 38 per cent. It's why we have our commitment to 100,000 apprenticeships during this Assembly term. It's why we are moving our policy in the apprenticeship area, to put new emphasis on higher level skills. There is much that the Government is doing and will continue to do. But the Member also has to face the facts that businesses, public services and universities in Wales rely on our ability to recruit people from other parts of the European Union, and other parts of the world, to come and make their futures here in Wales. Not only will Brexit be an impediment to that, but the policies being pursued by his Government in relation to migration will make those difficulties even greater, and that's why we will oppose those ideas as vigorously as we can.

Dawn Bowden AC: First Minister, on the back of the recent launch of an upskilling at work event at Merthyr College, I had the opportunity to discuss with them the importance of skills and apprenticeships to small and medium-sized firms in the constituency. And, from what I heard, it seems that there may be a reluctance on the part of some SMEs to actually take advantage of the apprenticeship schemes, possibly due to lack of awareness, or concern about what they might consider to be bureaucracy or a burdensome responsibility taking people on in that way. So, I just wanted to know what more the Welsh Government could do to encourage more SME employers in particular to take up apprenticeship opportunities in this vital sector in communities like Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney.

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, I thank Dawn Bowden for that. I want to congratulate Merthyr College for the work that they do in this area. One of the great success stories of devolution, Merthyr College, in its development over the period since 1999. And no doubt partly as a result of the sorts of events that Dawn Bowden mentioned, then 57 per cent of apprenticeship starts in Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney constituency are already identified as being with a small or medium-sized enterprise, and that 57 per cent compares with 51 per cent across Wales as a whole. So, there clearly is good work already going on in the Member's constituency. But she's right, of course, that, for a very small company, the responsibility of taking on an apprentice can appear difficult, and it's why we have developed the idea of shared apprenticeships in Wales, where employers, particularly small employers, can share an apprentice and share the responsibility and the administration that goes with it. The Aspire project in Merthyr Tydfil is one of those schemes. It's been a success already and there's more success to come. I understand that there's a celebration event planned for the Aspire project in the autumn that my colleague Ken Skates will be attending, and it will be an opportunity both to celebrate the success there has already been in the Merthyr and Rumney constituency and to highlight the opportunities that exist for small and medium-sized enterprises in the apprenticeship field in exactly the way that Dawn Bowden suggested.

Children's Rights

Helen Mary Jones AC: 2. Will the First Minister make a statement on how the Welsh Government promotes a children's rights-based approach when working with non-devolved bodies? OAQ54290

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question. The Welsh Government encourages all public bodies to take a children’s rights approach to their work. We stand ready to support any non-devolved body through comprehensive information and training.

Helen Mary Jones AC: Diolch. I'm very grateful to the First Minister for his answer. There was a joint meeting last week of the cross-party group on violence against women and girls and the cross-party group on violence against children, looking at the family courts and the work that CAFCASS are doing. It was very encouraging to hear how CAFCASS Cymru are beginning to take a much more child's rights-based approach in how they deal with preparing reports for family courts. However, it was very concerning to hear from women whose families have been through that experience the extent to which the family courts sometimes ignore CAFCASS's advice, don't appear to understand how important the voice of the child is in deciding issues around, for example, custody, with children very often being asked their opinions, their opinions being, from their perspective, disregarded, though, of course, it may be what the child wants is not necessarily always best for the child. There were some real concerns expressed in that room by professionals and by women alike that the family court service does not really understand the impact of domestic violence on children and how children should be encouraged to get their voices effectively heard. Can I ask the First Minister today to do some further work with the Counsel General to try to ensure that the appropriate approach that CAFCASS Wales is beginning to take to the experience of children who go through domestic abuse is also reflected and that the family courts are much more aware of the long-term impact of domestic abuse on children and how they can express their views?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, can I thank Helen Mary Jones for those very important points? The operation of the family courts in Wales is something that we rightly take an interest in here. My understanding is that the justice commission, chaired by Lord Thomas, has taken an increasing interest in its work in the operation of the family courts and that we can look to the report, which we expect in the autumn, to give us some advice on the relationship between the Welsh Government and family courts here in Wales. Helen Mary, I know, will be aware of the fact that the UK Government has recently announced a review of the family justice system, and the panel announced by the Ministry of Justice has not had a Welsh representative on it. So, I've written to the Secretary of State, urging him to make good that gap because there are aspects of the devolved settlement that mean that the work of the family courts directly has to rely on matters that are devolved here in Wales, including CAFCASS Cymru, and it's right that that review should be properly informed by all the work that goes on here in Wales. So, I entirely agree with what the Member said. I'm very happy to talk to the Counsel General. I want to provide her with an assurance that there are already actions being taken to make sure that our children's rights approach is fully communicated to non-devolved bodies when they operate here in Wales.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: First Minister, 'The Right Way: A Children’s Rights Approach' includes the need to enhance children's capabilities as individuals so they're better able to take advantage of their own rights. This, of course, includes article 3 of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, which states that the best interest of the child must be a top priority in all decisions and actionsthat affect children. Now, as Members, we've all received an e-mail from the Cross Keys Silver Band about the law requiring a licence for child performers. Locally, this is impacting on local musical bands who've also contacted me, and I've been approached by a number of parents too, very concerned. Now, your Welsh Government response is to liaise with local authorities to identify whether more can be done to make the process more consistent without jeopardising the safety of the child. This is obviously welcome, but it is true that the actual licence requirements would be, actually, quite a barrier to children joining these bands. So, will you consider the impact of the current licence on children's rights and, in doing so, whether organisations such as a brass band, which enhances the life advantages for our younger persons, whether there could be a more common-sense approach but whilst also keeping our children safe?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank Janet for that question and for drawing attention to the children's commissioner's 'The Right Way' document. It does, I think, provide a useful framework to support public services to embed children's rights in the way that they go about their responsibilities. I'm alert to the point that she makes about brass bands. I've already had an opportunity to discuss it with the Minister for Education. It's a matter of striking the right balance in just the way that the questioner put it. Of course we want to make sure that children are properly protected, that the right provision is in place, that when children are entrusted to the care of any organisation, parents can be confident that those children will be safe and properly looked after. But it does need to be proportionate to the task in hand.
Brass bands play a really important part in so many communities here in Wales, and children who take part in them get a fantastic experience as a result. Nothing that the Welsh Government wants to do is about putting extra barriers in the path of children's participation. It's why we want to make sure we've learnt from local authorities, and we will definitely be keeping a close look on the arrangements to make sure that they do what we want them to do—to help to keep children safe— and don't do what we don't want them to do, which is to be a barrier to children taking part in such a rich part of Wales's heritage.

Questions Without Notice from the Party Leaders

Questions now from the party leaders. The Plaid Cymru leader, Adam Price.

Adam Price AC: Diolch, Llywydd. First Minister, on 6 December 2017, you made a written statement on project bank accounts, designed to prevent smaller subcontractors losing money when larger firms go bust. You said,
'From 1 January 2018, project bank accounts will be used, unless there is a compelling reason not to do so, on all conventionally-funded construction and infrastructure contracts...fully or part-funded by the Welsh Government with a value of £2m or more'.
Since 1 January 2018, there have been 32 construction projects over £2 million fully or part funded by the Welsh Government. How many of those have used project bank accounts as you personally promised?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, I would expect them all to use project bank accounts on the terms that have been set out by the Welsh Government.

Adam Price AC: The answer is none of them. None of them. It's actually your own Government that responded to a freedom of information request yesterday. None of those 32 projects have actually used project bank accounts, despite what you've promised. That's a lot of compelling reasons, it must be.
Failure to deliver on commitments like that doesn't just hurt your reputation, First Minister, or that of your Government, it erodes trust in politics itself. Now, during the Labour Party conference in April, you said,
'we will end the demeaning and degrading practice of no-fault evictions for those people who live in the private rented sector',
yet, last week, your Minister for Housing and Local Governmentlaunched a consultation on extending the notice period on no-fault evictions from two months to six. Is that what you meant when you said you'd end no-fault evictions?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, on the first point the Member makes, I will make sure that I have an investigation of that matter and then we'll make sure that the full facts are known to Members of the Assembly.
On the second point, he will know that we are now in a position to implement the Renting Homes (Wales) Act 2016, passed on this Assembly floor in 2016, and that will allow us to implement section 173 of that Act, thus abolishing section 21 no-fault evictions. The consultation that was launched last week will be part of our implementation plan. It will certainly make a difference to no-fault evictions here in Wales and we will monitor very carefully the implementation of the new law that we will introduce to see that it is doing everything that we want it to do. If there are further steps that we need to take beyond the law that was passed in this Assembly only three years ago, then, of course, we will look at that, but nobody should pretend that the steps that we are now committed to taking do not make a very substantial step forward in our determination that no-fault evictions should not be part of the private rented landscape here in Wales.

Adam Price AC: That isn't what you're doing. I mean, your housing Minister actually gave a speech at Shelter, where she said that you're not ending them completely and you didn't want the perfect to be the end of the good. Why didn't you say that at your conference?
Now, the biggest promise, I guess, we make as public representatives is not to waste public money. Your Government has spent £9 million on a racing track and £123 million on a road that will never be built, but perhaps the most curious case of profligacy involves a photograph of Dylan Thomas. Seven years ago, Visit Wales, which was using the photo to promote the centenary of the poet's birth, was contacted by the owner of the copyright requesting that it should be removed. A day later, he was told that the image had been deleted and would not be used again. Nevertheless, Visit Wales went on to use the image both online and in print, and as a result, the copyright owner took legal action for breach of copyright. To date, you've spent over £800,000 on lawsuits in the UK and across the world, including over £1,600 flying two of your most senior tourism officials to a hearing in the Netherlands. The bill will soon reach £1 million, as you continue to appeal the judgments against you. This will be almost as much as what was spent five years ago on the entire Dylan Thomas centenary celebrations. How can you justify this waste of money, time and energy of your officials, or is it simply the case that the Welsh Government has nothing better to do?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, the Member has no idea at all of the complexities that lie behind this case. He grabs at a headline and he makes an allegation on the floor of the Assembly, which, if he had bothered to master the detail of what lies behind this case, he simply would not make. The Welsh Government is having to defend actions in courts across the world by an individual who is determined to pursue not simply the Welsh Government, but individual Welsh citizens in what I regard as the most vexatious way. We will not allow that to happen. I regret the costs, of course I do, but we are defending a really important principle and we are defending Welsh citizens here as well. If he had grasped the detail of the case, he would not have said what he has said here this afternoon.

Leader of the opposition, Paul Davies.

Paul Davies AC: Before I ask my first question today, with your indulgence, Llywydd, I'd also like to send my condolences to Rod Richards's family. His friends and family have spoken of his quick wit, kindness and love, and his colleagues have continued to admire his skills as a politician, and his passion for politics and what he believed in was clear for all to see. My thoughts and prayers are with his family at this very difficult time.
First Minister, do you believe that your Government is open and transparent?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, just before I answer that question, can I recognise what the leader of the opposition has said about Rod Richards, and say that I was glad to have had the opportunity at the weekend to express my condolences to members of his family as well?
And, Llywydd, of course, this Government aims to uphold the highest standards of openness and transparency in everything that we do.

Paul Davies AC: First Minister, in a previous exchange in this Chamber, you said that information is only available because your Government releases it, however, in the last week, two reports have had to be forced out of your Government—the report into kukd.com and the leak inquiry into the sacking of Carl Sargeant. Both of these reports are of an incredibly serious nature, and yet, many people are questioning the level of scrutiny that they can receive, as each one is lacking in detail. It is shocking that the report into the sacking of Carl Sargeant, which led to his death, is barely 350 words long. It is the shortest whitewash in history, First Minister. Now, in that report, the chief security officer used keywords to search the restored mailboxes of those with prior knowledge of the reshuffle. What were those keywords and how can we be confident that they would have captured the right e-mails? The report continues to say that following a questionnaire, where necessary, this was followed up with an interview or interviews. Can you tell us, therefore, how many people were interviewed, and were all staff with prior knowledge interviewed one-to-one? The report concludes that all Welsh Government disclosures were authorised disclosures. Can you tell us who authorised those disclosures?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, in answer to the Member's first question, I gave an assurance on the floor of this Assembly that we would publish that report, and that report is now available for scrutiny. As far as the leak inquiry report is concerned, it's not for me to know the answers to the questions that the Member has posed. This was an inquiry not conducted by Ministers, it was conducted in the way that leak inquiry reports are meant to be conducted, and the Cabinet Office has endorsed the way in which that inquiry was carried out. It's not for me to interfere in any way at all in the way that that inquiry was carried out. It's not for me to know who, where, when, why and what; that would be to interfere with the independence of the inquiry process.
On the floor of this Assembly, before Easter, there were requests made to me to publish the leak inquiry report. I thought very hard about those requests, because leak inquiry reports, by convention, are never published. They're never published by his Government in Westminster, for example, but, having given very careful consideration to it, I decided that this was a unique set of circumstances, and the publication of the report was therefore merited. I very deliberately, Llywydd, did not read the leak inquiry report before it was published last week, because I didn't want my decision on publication to be anything to do with its content. I wanted simply to make the decision on the merits of the argument that there was a public interest in it being published. That report has now been published in the way that I promised, and I've got nothing further to add to it.

Paul Davies AC: The second report, if it can be called that, into kukd.com is, shockingly, longer than the leak inquiry, reaching just over 500 words, but is more of a timeline of what action the Government has taken. It has no detail, no specifics on the allegations that have been received and no information on the various investigations that have been undertaken internally. First Minister, I am concerned that it took nearly 18 months for the police to confirm that they did not intend to pursue the case. What information did the internal audit team discover that warranted the file being referred to the police? And finally, First Minister, on 14 May, when I first raised this with you, you said that
'of course—we are committed to learning the lessons from those experiences'.
From this report, First Minister, what lessons can you learn, and do you believe this report represents the right level of scrutiny, and how much money has now been repaid by kukd.com?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, internal audit procedures are always designed to make a judgment as to whether or not what may have happened should be of interest to the police. I share the Member's frustration at the length of time that it sometimes takes for police to conduct their enquiries and to decide whether or not they want to bring forward prosecutions. But that is the correct relationship. Internal audit decides whether there is a case to be examined, and then prosecution authorities come to their own separate conclusion as to whether or not to take action of a criminal nature, and that's what happened in this case. I regret some of the time delays that seem to surround some of these sorts of cases, but that is the right way for these things to happen.
Scrutiny of decisions that we make happens all the time. It's part of the way in which decisions are made. There is always internal challenge to them, there are always questions that are asked, and when a decision is made, there is always a scrutiny of the implementation of that decision. In instances where investments are made and things don't work out as we had hoped, then, of course, we go beyond that, and that's what we have done in this caseand that's why I listened carefully to what the leader of the opposition said to me some weeks ago, and the report is now available for people to see. We will go on learning the lessons from all these experiences, as any sensible Government would do. The publication of the report is part of that, but there are all the normal ways in which Government assesses the efficiency and the effectiveness of decisions that we have taken, and looks to put right any deficits that are highlighted when we have reports of this sort.

Leader of the Brexit Party, Mark Reckless.

Mark Reckless AC: First Minister, you spoke last week about your desire to commence the first part of the Equality Act 2010 in Wales, so this week I'll ask you about section 20 and Schedule 2 to that Act. They provide for statutory investigation by the Equality and Human Rights Commission when an organisation is believed to have unlawfully discriminated against people because of their ethnicity and religious beliefs. It's happened once before in politics for the BNP. Is the EHRC right now to investigate the Labour Party, and do you agree with Alun Davies when he says he is deeply ashamed of what your party has become?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, let me deal with the substantive issue, rather than the peripheral ones, first. The substantive issue is to do with anti-Semitism, and I say here again on the floor of the Assembly, as I've said regularly whenever I've had the opportunity, that anti-Semitism has no part in the Labour Party in Wales and no part in Welsh life, and we will continue to work with Jewish organisations to make sure that the contribution that Jewish communities have made to Wales is properly understood and recognised, and where there are instances of anti-Semitism of any sort, then those must be dealt with, and dealt with rapidly.
The Member asks me about the EHRC inquiry, and he'll be pleased to know, I'm sure, that the Welsh Labour Party is not within the scope of that inquiry.

Mark Reckless AC: Thank you for that answer. I wonder why that is thought not to be within the scope. One Labour staffer who bravely spoke to BBC Panoramasaid investigators were undermined, when given cases, by people wanting leniency on anti-Semitism, then taking those cases away. Often, that was people from Jeremy Corbyn's office, but isn't it also what you did, First Minister? I hear the previous First Minister muttering, but when one of your Assembly Members made what were widely considered to be anti-Semitic remarks, she was suspended from your group and your predecessor referred her to the Labour Party for investigation. Yet, according to The Jewish Chronicle, once you took over as First Minister, and I quote,
'No consideration was given to the fact that UK Labour had yet to conclude their investigation into her remarks',
since, and I quote,
'she might have been a bit stupid',
but this was 'our Jenny'. The Jewish Chronicle continued:
'Mark (Drakeford) and almost the entire group, barring Alun, Lynne and Vaughan seemed determined to get her back as quickly as they could.'
First Minister, many of your AMs oppose Jeremy Corbyn becoming your leader, and seem none too keen on him becoming Prime Minister, but you were one of his original supporters. Did you know then that he had complained when his council took down a grotesque anti-Semitic mural? Do you agree with him that Hobson's anti-Semitic book, Imperialism,was 'brilliant'? And what do you think Jeremy Corbyn meant when he said Zionists 'don't understand English irony'? First Minister, for how much longer will you and your party and your Government tolerate what your deputy leader rightly describes as anti-Jewish racism?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I'm not going to be drawn into answering questions that have nothing to do with my responsibilities on the floor of this National Assembly. I have set out here my views on anti-Semitism and the way in which these matters are conducted here in Wales. Nothing will deflect me from standing up to those values and those principles, and nothing that the Member wishes to draw me into will be used to try and deflect me from my determination that the rights of all communities here in Wales are respected. Wherever they come from, whatever their heritage, their contribution here in Wales is valued, recognised and celebrated, and that's the sort of culture that I want to see, politically and socially, across the whole of our nation.

Accountability in the Welsh NHS

Darren Millar AC: 3. Will the First Minister make a statement on accountability in the Welsh NHS? OAQ54256

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank that Member for that question. Local health boards and NHS trusts in Wales are statutory bodies, and accountable for the planning, delivery and improvement of services they provide. Welsh Government sets the frameworks and requirements against which they operate.

Darren Millar AC: First Minister, scandals in the care of elderly patients at the Tawel Fan ward in north Wales and in the care of mothers and babies in the Cwm Taf University Health Board area in south Wales have exposed, I believe, some very serious weaknesses in the accountability arrangements in the Welsh NHS. The fact that not a single person has been sacked for the serious failings in care that have been exposed in the hospitals concerned I believe is totally unacceptable. It's an injustice, and it adds further insult to injury for the families and loved ones of those affected. When will your Government address this accountability deficit in our Welsh NHS, and will you, as a former health Minister—and, indeed, your current health Minister—accept that you have a responsibility to act in order to ensure that we get to grips with the lack of accountability in the Welsh NHS and that people pay a price when they're responsible for things that go wrong?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I just want to put on record the fact that, in terms of accountability, all our boards in Wales have model standing orders, all have standing financial instructions, they all have a behavioural code and they all have an accountability code. So, accountability in the Welsh NHS is something that has been part of the culture of the service since its inception, and has been further reinforced during the period of devolution. There is a further period now in which Members can engage with this agenda.
The Health and Social Care (Quality and Engagement) (Wales) Bill is in front of the Assembly. It will allow any Member who has proposals to make that can address deficits as they see them in the way that the health service operates to put those ideas forward to have them rehearsed in front of the scrutiny committee. But let me just say this, Llywydd: politicians don't sack public service employees in Wales. That is not the way that the system operates, and nor should it. Where things go wrong and where people make mistakes—and sometimes worse than mistakes—then there is an accountability system through professional organisations and employment law, and that needs to be effective. But we don't make those decisions on the floor of this Assembly—nor should we.

Caroline Jones AC: First Minister, there was an alarming number of deaths and a large number of patients suffering severe harm due to patient safety breaches in our NHS over the past 12 months. Two thirds of the deaths and 58 per cent of the severe harm occurred in Betsi Cadwaladr. I'm sure that you will agree with me that this is unacceptable. So, First Minister, what is wrong with the culture at this health board, which is being run by your Government? Do you accept that there is a problem in how our NHS operates, and will you now back Helen Mary's Bill to improve NHS accountability?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, the Member makes a fundamental mistake, I believe, in interpreting reports of serious incidents as evidence that this means that everything is going wrong. For years in this Assembly, we've had this debate. I remember it very well over the save 1000 Lives campaign, launched nearly a decade ago, where we have consistently said that we want a culture in the Welsh NHS that, if you see something that has gone wrong, then you report it and you make sure that you learn from that experience. It does not mean at all that those incidents have done actual harm. It means that the risk of harm has been identified. And, in a learning culture, people are encouraged to come forward, report it and get that known among their colleagues.
If, every time those figures are published, we have people saying, 'Oh, this means that people are in danger in the Welsh NHS,' all we will do is to persuade people not to take that course of action—exactly the opposite of the sort of culture that I think, across many parts of this Assembly, we have worked to try to engender. The fact that some health boards are better at it and have persuaded more people to buy into that culture should be a matter of commendation for them, not a matter of trying to say that they are the worst in the bunch. I want an NHS where people are confident that, if there are things that they want to bring to attention, they will know that that is a valued and rewarded part of the work that they do, and then, when we get figures that demonstrate that, we should all be willing to say that that is evidence of a learning organisation determined to make things better, not evidence of an organisation that's always getting things wrong.

Housing Policy

John Griffiths AC: 4. Will the First Minister make a statement on the Welsh Government's housing policy? OAQ54246

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, our ambition is for everyone to have a decent home that is affordable, safe and secure. That is why we are tackling homelessness in all its forms, providing support to help households maintain their tenancies and committed to significant social housing building here in Wales.

John Griffiths AC: First Minister, homelessness and rough-sleeping are major problems, and obviously many years of UK Tory Government austerity have had a grave impact on our public services and on vulnerable people in our communities. And it is a cumulative impact year on year, so, in trying to counter that, I do believe that Welsh Government's Housing First policy is an important part of the necessary and the right approach, and the pilot areas, I believe, are very welcome. But we do need to have the appropriate accommodation available right across Wales if Housing First is to be rolled out across the length and breadth of our country. So, I wonder if you could offer any reassurance that that necessary accommodation will be available throughout Wales, and, if so, when it would be in place.

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I want to thank John Griffiths for an important question. He's right to say that there is no more visible sign of the impact of a decade of austerity than the on-the-street homelessness that we see today, and which, in my earlier lifetime, was never seen at all. It's why we are putting £20 million more into housing homelessness services in this year alone. It's why the housing Minister has commissioned the chief officer of the charity Crisis to chair a group that is looking at the services that we will provide in Wales as we move into the second half of this year. Our ambition, as the Member knows, is that, where homelessness takes place, it should be rare, it should be brief, and it should be non-recurrent, and Housing First is a very important part of that. It's why we put £1.6 million specifically into that initiative during this financial year, and, as John Griffiths said in his supplementary question, the Housing First model requires two things. Of course, it requires accommodation, and accommodation is under severe pressure right across Wales, but it needs services as well. The people who are placed, in the Housing First model, directly into accommodation, are often people who will need support to make sure that they can settle and then sustain the tenancies that will be available to them, and that is the model that we are developing here in Wales.

David Melding AC: First Minister, housing policy has a key role to play in tackling climate change. The UK Government announced yesterday that it will amend building regulations so that the installation of charge points for electrical vehicles will be required on all new housing developments. You may have realised that, when the Welsh Conservative group published its housing strategy, this was one of the things that we urged the Welsh Government to do. You've had some time to think about this, and obviously now you could emulate what is going to happen in England, which would be the first Government, I understand, to introduce this policy. But do you welcome this initiative, and will you be looking seriously to introduce that reform of building regulations in Wales also?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank David Melding for that, and, to agree with his opening point that housing policy and climate change are very closely related, we know that we will need a major retrofitting programme here in Wales to make housing built in a previous generation fit for the decarbonisation and climate change challenges that we face. The Welsh Government, using some of the £2 million that we agreed with Plaid Cymru as part of an earlier budget agreement, has been investing in public charging points in Wales. We're up to 800 this month. We had 670 as recently as April, so the number is increasing—not as rapidly as we might like, but definitely increasing. But the point that David Melding makes is right—most charging still happens domestically in people's own homes and the homes that we are building for the future will need to be equipped to make sure that they are equipped to offer this facility to people, and we are taking action to push that agenda forward and we'll look carefully to see what was announced yesterday.

Supporting Carers

Jayne Bryant AC: 5. What is the Welsh Government doing to support carers? OAQ54291

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank Jayne Bryant for that question. The Social Services and Well-being (Wales) Act 2014 is groundbreaking as it gives carers the same right to support as those for whom they care. Welsh Government also invests significant resources, including through the integrated care fund, to support the well-being of carers.

Jayne Bryant AC: Thank you, First Minister. Carers groups are invaluable to many, and one of my constituents, Chris Kemp-Philp, told a recent event here in the Senedd that Newport Carers Forum saved her life, and it’s like having a second supportive family. Last week, Chris and other members of the Newport Carers Forum came to the public gallery to watch my short debate on caring for our carers. The forum is a vital support network for adult carers, people whose contribution to society is often overlooked. There’s no doubt that we couldn't do without carers. Sadly, many of them feel undervalued, and that was evident to me when I visited them yesterday in Newport to discuss carers. We know that figures of carers are underestimated and they’re growing. The 16,000 carers in Newport face similar issues to the 370,000 carers across Wales. Respite is vital in avoiding care breakdown. Reductions in respite packages hugely impact on carers. What action is the Welsh Government taking to ensure that carers receive the right respite that they need?

Mark Drakeford AC: Can I thank Jayne Bryant both for that question and for the work that she is doing to make sure that, on the floor of this Assembly, we continue, as we have, I think, for many years, to have the needs and interests of carers firmly in front of us? It was great to see the Newport Carers Forum here in the gallery listening to the short debate last week.
Of course, respite care is very important, both for carers, but also for the people they care for as well. It’s why we’ve put money directly into the hands of local authorities—£3 million of Welsh Government money—to support carers in that way. It’s also true, Llywydd, I think, that there is a new debate happening across Wales about the form of respite care, and about innovation in the way that respite is provided—‘rethinking respite’, I think, is the slogan that’s used by those people who are part of that debate, and we want to be part of that here through the carers ministerial advisory group. You see it, Llywydd, I think, particularly in the integrated care fund; £15 million of that fund is specifically set aside to provide for the needs of people in the community, and direct support to carers is part of that £15 million package—looking at new ways in which things can be done, recognising the importance of respite care, and, crucially, working with carers groups of the sort that there are in Newport to make sure that the revised services of the future are genuinely co-produced, learning from those who benefit from them and on whose voluntary efforts we so much rely.

Mark Isherwood AC: The integrated autism service and autism spectrum disorder strategic action plan final report, commissioned by the Welsh Government, was published at the end of March. This said that,
'whilst the IAS can work with parents and carers it cannot work directly with children',
with consequent reliance upon education services to provide support following diagnosis, but, quote,
‘there are continuing weaknesses in education provision for children with autism’
and
'also concerns that this means little support for parents and carers in the home'.
Reponses to their survey from parents and carers indicated continuing gaps and weakness in post-diagnostic support, with almost half reporting they had no support after diagnosis. How, therefore, do you respond to the concern raised with me by a charity supporting children of families in north Wales—children with autism in families in north Wales—that carers often have to give up their careers and full-time work due to long-term caring responsibilities and family stress, with financial worries caused adding to the stress of an already very stressful family environment?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I suppose I respond in two ways: first of all by acknowledging what we know about the impact that caring for a child with any form of disability or special need has on family life, and to put in place the services that we knoware needed to help those families to go on doing the thing that they almost always want to do the most, and that is to go on having care of that child. The second thing, then, is to echo what was said in the report that the Member quoted from, because what that report is saying is that we need a service for those children and those families that draws together the contribution that all services make—the contribution from the health service, the contribution from social services, the contribution from the education service as well. The Additional Learning Needs and Education Tribunal (Wales) Act 2018 that was passed on this Assembly's floor and will be implemented from September of next year, with £20 million to support preparation for it, has at its heart that idea of the child at the centre of all the decisions that are made. So, the ambitions in the report that Mark Isherwood quoted from are ambitions that we share, and the actions that we have taken in creating the integrated autism service, in instituting a cognitive development service for young people alongside the child and adolescent mental health service, in reforming the way in which education services respond to young people with special needs—all of that is part of our determination to draw those services together around the family and to support them in the vital work that they do.

Employment Figures

David J Rowlands AC: 6. Will the First Minister make a statement on the Welsh Government's employment figures? OAQ54270

Mark Drakeford AC: At the end of June, the Welsh Government employed the full-time equivalent of 5,251 staff. Figures on the number of staff employed are published periodically on the Welsh Government’s website.

David J Rowlands AC: Well, I thank the First Minister for his answer, but in answer to a similar question I asked last week, you said that Wales had record employment levels, record low unemployment and a record number of people in work. Whilst I welcome these comments at face value, when we analysed the figures behind your statement, it would appear that the picture is not as rosy as at first you may assert. It appears that the majority of new jobs created are either in the public sector or the third sector. And, again, if we analyse those that are created in the private sector, we find that they are either agency workers or, worse still, zero-hours contracts. There has long been an imbalance in Wales with regard to the public sector being far too large for the private sector to support. Could the First Minister tell us what measures he is putting in place to redress this over-reliance on growth in the public sector workforce and to expand good, well-paid jobs in the private sector?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, I simply won't join in this old and hackneyed mantra of 'private good, public bad'. It's simply not true and it's never had traction here in Wales or on the floor of this Assembly. But the Member is, in any case, simply factually wrong. The growth in employment in Wales comes far more from private sector employment than it does from public sector employment. He's simply wrong in what he has said here this afternoon. That's where the growth in employment in Wales has come from. He's also wrong to repeat that tired old assertion that the jobs that are created in Wales are not jobs worth having. More than half the jobs created in Wales in the last decade have been in the top three occupational classes. So, these very old and tired ideas that the Welsh economy is overbalanced in favour of the public sector—that's not true. We have a vibrant public sector that crowds in private sector activity, and there's more growth in private jobs than public jobs. The jobs that are created are concentrated in the better-paid jobs, not the worst-paid jobs. That's the truth of the Welsh economy, and the dismal picture that he paints of it simply is not true.

Leanne Wood AC: In the Rhondda, where we have a stubborn problem with underemployment as well as unemployment, there is a newly formed co-operative of highly skilled garment workers, formerly employed by Burberry, who hope to do something about that. This group were led to believe that Welsh Government money would be available to them for capital investment so that they could set up and, as a first order, make the current and new uniforms for Transport for Wales. This proposal had the backing of the RMT union in Wales, but for some reason the Welsh Government has suddenly cooled. This cooling period coincided with around £1.5 million committed to Ebbw Vale, where there are no workers with these particular skills. The Treorchy Burberry co-operative have been told that there still may be some money available for them in the future, but there are no promises and there are no guarantees. After initial enthusiasm, these people have been left in the dark. First Minister, what assurances can you provide to this co-operative about future funding and contracts? Will you and the economy Minister agree to meet with this co-operative as soon as possible to make their realistic hopes a reality? I am convinced that this might not just be an exciting opportunity for the Rhondda, but in the future could also be a major contributor to the Welsh economy and eventually quite a significant employer. So, will you revive your original enthusiasm for this project?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, I'm aware of the garment workers' co-operative idea, and I know some of the people who've been at the heart of developing the idea. So, the positive case for it is one that I think the Member rightly makes. I think it's a shame that she then goes on to try and divide people who are in disadvantage by trying to make a contrast between one part of Wales and another. That's not the way to build support for this idea. I'm not aware myself directly of any cooling on the part Welsh Government in our support for the idea of the garment workers' co-operative. I'll have further discussions with ministerial colleagues, of course, to find the latest state of play in relation to it. If the scheme is worth supporting, we will certainly want to support it, and we won't be supporting it on the basis that it's a competition between those workers and workers elsewhere in Wales.

The Taskforce on the Ford Bridgend Plant

Dai Lloyd AC: 7. Will the First Minister provide an update on the priorities of the Welsh Government's taskforce on the Ford Bridgend plant? OAQ54247

Mark Drakeford AC: May I thank Dai Lloyd for the question? The taskforce priorities focus on people, potential and place—supporting workers and their families, identifying new economic opportunities and building the economic and social resilience of the Bridgend community in particular.

Dai Lloyd AC: I thank the First Minister for that answer. In terms of the Bridgend taskforce, obviously, as I mentioned on Friday in the Committee for the Scrutiny of the First Minister, the mood music seems one of resignation, partially, to the fact that Ford is not going to play a part on the Bridgend site in future. You suggested in one of your answers on Friday that the Government is pursuing 17 other opportunities for the site, involving Ineos and Aston Martin investing in the area. Understandably, there continues to be uncertainty and worry locally in Bridgend—and the whole of south Wales, actually; it's not just a Bridgend issue here, as I know people in Swansea who work at that Ford plant. Therefore, when do you expect to be providing any updates or announcements on future plans for the area, and with the summer recess upon us, will you commit to keeping us informed of developments as Assembly Members?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for that question, and for the discussion that we had at the scrutiny committee in Wrexham on Friday. I understand the point that he made then and today about a sense of resignation, but just to be completely clear, Llywydd, that is not the position of the Welsh Government. Ford had a highly skilled, dedicated and loyal workforce in Bridgend. The Bridgend community has been loyal to Ford for 40 years. Welsh citizens and UK citizens have been loyal to Ford in buying their products and making them the most successful products on the car market. And the taxpayer has been loyal to Ford over that period in giving it over £140 million. We say to the company: it's time to repay that loyalty. And we have not given up—certainly not given up—on the belief that Ford should be persuaded, in whole or in part, to remain in Bridgend, and that remains at the top of our agenda. But we have to prepare, as the Member recognised in the discussion that we had on Friday, against other eventualities. The other expressions of interest from 17 other sources in bringing work to that site in Bridgend are part of the effort that we are making to make sure that Bridgend is promoted and understood as an excellent place to come and do business. I'm very pleased to give the Member an assurance that, as things develop, and particularly if they develop during the recess period, of course we will make sure through written statements and other means that Members here are kept thoroughly informed. Because Dr Lloyd is completely right, Llywydd, that there are many constituencies across south Wales, my own included, where there are people who work at the Ford factory in Bridgend, and there is a shared interest in making sure that we all do whatever we can to retain an interest in the developments and support the efforts that are being made to find successful futures for those families.

And finally, question 8, Andrew R.T. Davies.

Professional Lobbyists

Andrew RT Davies AC: 8. Will the First Minister make a statement on the relationship between his office and professional lobbyists? OAQ54265

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, the rules in relation to ministerial relationships with professional lobbyists are set out in the ministerial code.

Andrew RT Davies AC: Thank you for that answer, First Minister. I heard what you said to the leader of the opposition in respect of the leak inquiry. But it is important when it comes to Cabinet reshuffles, for which you and your office are solely responsible, that there is confidentiality. The economy Secretary highlighted that yesterday in comments that he made. There is an impression—whether that's right or wrong—that information was circulating amongst certain lobbyists that they were informed of what might've happened at the last Government—[Interruption.] I can again hear the former First Minister chuntering—[Interruption.] You tried to shout me down last time, former First Minister—[Interruption.] You will not silence me—

Allow the Member to continue with his questioning.

Andrew RT Davies AC: You will not silence me on this, First Minister. And quite clearly, the leak inquiry highlights that there was evidence of authorised sharing. It is in there. It might only be 330 words, former First Minister, but it's there. And if you want to debate it, I'll happily debate it with you—

You need to address—

Andrew RT Davies AC: —but I'll direct my comments—

You need to address your question to the First Minister.

Andrew RT Davies AC: I will gladly refer to the current First Minister, because the question is pointed at him. What have you learnt, First Minister, from the previous Cabinet reshuffle, which had such tragic consequences, and what measures are you putting in place that will give Ministers that confidentiality, which the economy Secretary highlighted in his comments yesterday, that Cabinet Ministers do deserve when there's a reshuffle taking place?

Mark Drakeford AC: Well, Llywydd, Members here will know that the coroner put a series of questions to me about the arrangements that surround reshuffles within the Cabinet here in the Welsh Government, and I made a statement to the coroner setting out the arrangements that I would intend to put in place, and that statement was read into the record of the coroner's hearings and is available to all Members. Members will also know that the coroner took a decision to issue a prevention of future deaths report in which he looks for some further details of how reshuffles are conducted in a Government and the support services that are made available to those caught up in them. The Government has 56 days, as is the case with any prevention of future deaths report, to respond to the questions that the coroner has posed. I will take those questions very seriously. I will respond in full to them, and I will take the time that is necessary and is allowed for in the prevention of future deaths context to come to those conclusions. When I make my further submission to the coroner, I will make sure that that submission is published and available to all Members.

Thank you, First Minister.

Questions to the Deputy Minister and Chief Whip

The next questions are questions to the Deputy Minister and Chief Whip, and the first question is from Dai Lloyd.

The Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015

Dai Lloyd AC: 1. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on the delivery of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015? OAQ54288

Jane Hutt AC: Earlier today I published a report on Wales’s contribution to global efforts to transform the world for people, planet and prosperity. This reflected the importance of our well-being of future generations Act in driving this change in Wales and beyond.

Dai Lloyd AC: Thank you for that answer, Minister. You will no doubt be aware that the number of pubs across Wales is falling. Very often, of course, the local pub acts as a community centre, a place for people to meet up and have a chat. The role of the local pub can often be central in terms of tackling loneliness and isolation and in terms of creating sustainable, cohesive communities in line with the well-being of future generations Act. Now, when pubs close and change their use, often for residential purposes, as seen with a current pub in Resolven, in the Neath valley, the community loses an asset. Will the Welsh Government now commit to looking at protecting pubs and restaurants, by giving local communities the opportunity of registering them as assets of community value, as happens in England, and give these communities the chance to keep these pubs open as community facilities?

Jane Hutt AC: Diolch yn fawr, Dai Lloyd. An interesting reflection on the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. Of course, the loss of pubs has often been the loss of community facilities, and indeed many pubs have—I have a pub in my own constituency that has just managed, through a community effort, to stay open as a very important focus for community activities. But I think we will certainly look into the issue, in terms of the status of those pubs. I'm sure this depends on ownership, in terms of the building, and the brewery's involvement in it. But certainly, I think the point is that we need to look at all our community facilities, look at community asset transfer, which has been very successful, and look, for example, at opportunities from the communities facilities programme. And I hope that Members across the Chamber will have seen my written statement today, showing how we've invested in a number of community projects that can also help to reduce loneliness and ensure that there is well-being in our communities.

Janet Finch-Saunders.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: Is this number one?

Yes, it is.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: I'm just checking.

Are you ready, Janet Finch-Saunders?

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: I am ready, thank you, Llywydd.

You're lucky it's the last week of term.

Janet Finch-Saunders AC: The Act has an admirable aim of achieving seven well-being goals across Wales. These include, of course, a Wales of cohesive communities, meaning that we should have well-connected communities. Key to this, of course, is public transport. However, I have found myself fighting three major campaigns to save our bus services in Aberconwy. So it does seem that north Wales is actually stepping further away from having a cohesive community. The need for the Welsh Government to invest more in public transport has been highlighted by the Future Generations Commissioner for Wales. There are scathing facts in the report that she published last month, including that spend per capita on transport in Wales is lower than England and Scotland. Will you commit to making more money available, so that we reach the aim of the future generations Act, so that we achieve cohesive communities, and therefore, in the same time, we save our local bus networks, which are so badly needed, but very much valued by our local communities?

Jane Hutt AC: Well, I have no dispute at all with Janet Finch-Saunders about the importance of our public transport system. I regretted enormously the deregulation of bus services when I was a former councillor, and we can see the chaos that that has resulted in—no strategic direction, local authorities trying to play their role, particularly ensuring that some of our bus companies, like Cardiff and Newport, for example, have been able to keep their bus services. It is important that every time you engage in a campaign to save a service, you also have to recognise that this is about priorities. Every time a Welsh Conservative says, 'Can you put more money in this?', I would say, 'Well, what are you asking your Government in Westminster after 10 years of austerity?', and, 'From where would you take the money, Janet Finch-Saunders, in order to put more money into our bus services?' Now, I know the well-being of future generations commissioner has done some very useful work in terms of our transport system arrangements, and contributed, particularly, for example, to the WelTAG considerations, as well as planning policy. But it is important that we see that our bus services are part of cohesive communities, in providing access for our communities to work, to leisure, and to combat loneliness.

Promoting Equality

Delyth Jewell AC: 2. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on Welsh Government efforts to promote equality in South Wales East? OAQ54283

Jane Hutt AC: The Welsh Government is committed to creating a society where diversity is valued and respected, where people do not face discrimination and prejudice, and a society where everyone can participate, flourish, and have the opportunity to fulfil their potential, across the whole of Wales.

Delyth Jewell AC: Thank you for your response. You may be aware that the decision to close Pontllanfraith leisure centre was recently overturned, on the basis that Caerphilly County Borough Council had failed to take into account the effect of closure on disadvantaged people in the area as part of its equality duty. Minister, would you agree that the council failed in its duties to disadvantaged peoplein this regard, and can you inform us how your Government intends to ensure that local authorities comply with their duties in relation to equality in future?
There's a wider point to be considered here as well, which is that vulnerable people's needs are too often neglected due to their voices not being heard and pressures caused by austerity. It's too easy for them to fall between the cracks of services when referrals aren't chased up and services don't talk to one another. When people are vulnerable, be they victims of abuse, those with alcohol and drug addiction, people who are homeless, veterans of the armed forces, it affects every aspect of their life. So, Minister, could you tell me what work the Welsh Government is putting in place to strengthen referral pathways for people in these precarious situations to reduce the number of cases that drop off the books?

Jane Hutt AC: Well, I'm glad you also recognise, Delyth, the impact of austerity. Of course, that impact has a huge impact in terms of the ability of local authorities to not only maintain crucial services like our leisure services, but also in terms of opportunities to develop services with support from the Welsh Government. I think you raise important issues in relation to equality and human rights because we have a strategic equality plan that's looking towards outcomes. It is about the equality outcomes that we need to deliver. But also we do have public sector equality duties that all local authorities also have to consider and abide by, and, in fact, we are looking to strengthen the outcome of those duties on local authorities because they have to ensure that they are meeting the needs of our most vulnerable, but particularly those with protected characteristics. So, this is an issue where, of course, we have to work collaboratively with our local authorities, recognising the pressures that they're under, but ensuring that the voices of people, particularly those who are the most vulnerable, are heard.

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: Deputy Minister, with regard to the gender pay gap, it is a fact that women remain under-represented in apprenticeship positions in better-paid industries in Wales. In 2016-17, within construction and engineering programmes, there were only 360 female apprentices compared to 8,330. What discussion has the Deputy Minister had with her colleagues to address the gender pay gap by encouraging more women to take apprenticeships in these businesses and sectors? You've just mentioned the outcome in your party, but what is the duty? You haven't performed the duty to make sure a gender balance in the pay sector is achieved by the Labour Party.

Jane Hutt AC: Clearly, the Equality Act 2010 provides those specific duties to ensure that we do protect everyone from discrimination and particularly that includes tackling the gender pay gap. It is the responsibility—. The specific duties that are under the Act ensure that we have to look at those specific duties particularly the gender pay gap, but I would also say that that gender pay gap is something in terms of ensuring that we have the data in terms of the gender pay differences, and we have a gender pay action plan. And I think also we have to recognise that there are also pay gaps that we need to address in terms of ethnicity and disability, and we are looking towards ways in which we can address those as well. But it is important that our Wales-specific duties in terms of the equality Act are there to ensure that we do address these issues, that we have equality impact assessments, we have equality in employment information, and we have that published. And I met with all the local authorities last week to stress the importance of that duty and responsibility.

Increasing Diversity in Elected Office

Mike Hedges AC: 3. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on increasing diversity in elected office? OAQ54253

Jane Hutt AC: A report on the Welsh Government diversity and democracy initiative was published on 26 June. A further phase of the project will commence shortly and will build on that earlier work in advance of the next local government elections.

Mike Hedges AC: Can I thank the Minister for that response? I think we have seen some progress—albeit slowly—across a large number of areas like MPs, AMs, and even councillors. Something that concerns me is that we've had seven police and crime commissioners, not one has been a woman, not one has been from an ethnic minority, and it's very much the situation that people are looking at it and seeing that it's only people of a certain type who may be able to stand for becoming police and crime commissioners. What can we do to ensure we have a better mix in police and crime commissioners?

Jane Hutt AC: Well, I thank the Member for his question. I recognise there is a way to go with PCCs. Some of the police and crime commissioners have appointed deputies who reflect the diversity of the communities they serve, and this has been a very positive step. But, of course, like all elected offices, it's political parties who need to make efforts to ensure that they encourage and support people from diverse backgrounds putting themselves forward for these offices. Of course, PCCs aren't devolved, but I will ask officials to raise these concerns in conversations with the UK Government on electoral matters.

Suzy Davies AC: You may remember, of course, Dame Rosemary Butler's campaign to try and encourage more women into public life, so it's this Assembly as a whole and not just Welsh Government that has something of a good story to tell on at least the beginnings of progress.
I've just come back from the final session of the all-Wales BAME engagement programme, run by Ethnic Minorities and Youth Support Team Wales. I know that you're a mentor there as well. It's very rewarding for mentors and mentees alike, and showing the early signs of being effective as well. As you know, there are a number of organisations working in this territory now, so can you tell me how you, Deputy Minister, can use your budget to support and promote the particular programmes of those organisations and others like them?

Jane Hutt AC: I also welcome, Suzy Davies, the all-Wales BAME mentoring engagement programme, and I've been very inspired by the mentees and I'm sure you have, and others who have taken part in that are also keen. I think you might be, Suzy Davies, a mentor in the Women's Equality Network Wales mentoring programme, as others are across this Chamber. We see this as a key role to play in terms of supporting those mentoring arrangements in terms of developing future diversity in all public appointments and, indeed, in mentees considering the possibility of elected office as well.
We have, of course, a diversity in democracy programme that we're taking forward in terms of local government, and I think that's reflected in the debate we had very recently. But also, this is reflected in the work that I'm doing in terms of public appointments. And we are looking at the ways in which the mentoring programmes can provide a key role to play in encouraging candidates and looking, of course, at the support for those organisations. Both of those organisations, actually, do already get support from the Welsh Government, but looking particularly at the impact of those mentoring programmes.

The Equality Act 2010

Russell George AC: 4. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement on the implementation of the Equality Act 2010 in Wales? OAQ54259

Jane Hutt AC: Last week, a symposium that I attended, organised with the Equality and Human Rights Commission, explored how the Welsh-specific regulations on the public sector equality duty could be strengthened. We're also commencing the socioeconomic duty, Part 1 of the equality Act.

Russell George AC: Thank you for your answer, Deputy Minister. Transport for Wales has to, of course, ensure that reasonable adjustments for disabled people are in place following the Act. Now, reasonable adjustment for a train where you could sit for over three hours between Aberystwyth and Birmingham International is simply, of course, a properly designed disabled toilet. It's the case at the moment that many disabled people can't use that facility, which, I'm sure, you would agree is totally unacceptable.
Last week, I was pleased to hear that the Minister for Economy, Transport and North Wales will be writing to Transport for Wales on this issue, but I wonder if you could add your weight to this, Minister, as the Minister responsible for implementing the Equality Act 2010, to ensure that reasonable steps are taken to rectify this situation at the earliest opportunity.

Jane Hutt AC: Certainly, Russell George, I will be backing the Minister for transport in respect of access, not just to that particular service, but in terms of the opportunities that Transport for Wales has to improve access. And, of course, we also have the opportunity with the new rolling stock to really be transformational in the way that we deliver on that.

Mick Antoniw AC: Minister, the Welsh Government has taken a very significant lead in agreeing to implement section 1 of the Equality Act 2010. There's been a campaign for many, many years to try and get this implemented with England and is still awaited. I wonder if you could outline the extent to which the socioeconomic duty will be at the core of Welsh Government policy, bearing in mind the scale of working people who are living in poverty at the moment, living on poor terms and conditions, but also the inequality that arises within that grouping of people as well.

Jane Hutt AC: I thank Mick Antoniw for that supplementary question, because it was mentioned, as you know, last week by the First Minister in the social partnership statement that we would enact Part 1 of the Equality Act 2010—the socioeconomic duty. In fact, this is a priority for me. In terms of taking this forward, to enact it by the end of this calendar year is our target. I'm meeting tomorrow with organisations to look at the ways in which the socioeconomic duty fits in with other legislative responsibilities and duties of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, but looking at where we can strengthen equality and human rights, and the socioeconomic duty plays a part in that. But I think the key point is that this will be new guidance that will ensure that we tackle the social disadvantage in our communities. It will require Welsh public bodies to make decisions—this goes back to Delyth's question earlier on—that tackle unequal outcomes caused by socioeconomic disadvantage. And that has been missing from the toolkit that we have to tackle poverty and inequality and to make sure that it is part of the duties of our public bodies.

The Welsh Government and the Future Generations Commissioner for Wales

Michelle Brown AC: 5. What assessment has the Minister made of the effectiveness of the liaison between the Welsh Government and the Future Generations Commissioner? OAQ54292

Jane Hutt AC: The commissioner provides both support and challenge to the Welsh Government on a range of policy areas, in particular those that reflect her priorities.

Michelle Brown AC: Thank you for that answer, Deputy Minister. I assume that you and the Government were delighted by the response from the future generations commissioner when you decided to ditch the M4 relief road on the grounds that it would destroy forever sites that we, as one generation, should not be depriving an untold number of future generations of. Turning historical, ancient landscape into concrete is a one-way action and there's no reverse or repair. So, I wonder whether your Government's desire to carve up a piece of rare wet woodland, destroying a large part of it and denying that rarity to our generation and every generation that follows in the name of the red route relief road in Flintshire, has met with the commissioner's approval. Has your Government asked the commissioner for her opinion and, if so, what was her reply, please?

Jane Hutt AC: This is an issue that, of course, has already been considered in terms of the red route by not just the Petitions Committee, but in response from the Minister for transport. We announced the red option as a preferred route to resolve traffic congestion in the Flintshire corridor in September 2017, and we're also progressing with the next steps of appointing technical advisers to develop a preliminary design on this route. It is important, of course, that this—consideration of it—forms part of the Welsh transport appraisal guidance, and officials work very closely with the future generations commissioner's office, as I said earlier on this afternoon, to update WelTAG to embed the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015.

Improving Human Rights

Vikki Howells AC: 6. Will the Deputy Minister outline the Welsh Government’s priorities for improving human rights during the remainder of this Assembly term? OAQ54258

Jane Hutt AC: The Welsh Government is working with key partners to explore action needed to safeguard and advance human rights in Wales. This work is aligned with the gender equality review, the existing framework provided by the Equality Act 2010 and the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015.

Vikki Howells AC: Thank you, Deputy Minister. I was interested recently to read Oxfam's supermarket scorecard. That campaign analyses how well supermarkets promote human rights within their food chain. The picture is very mixed,with, for example, good progress from Aldi, contrasting with other chains that worryingly received no score at all for ensuring that women workers are treated fairly and equally. How is the Welsh Government working with employers to ensure that human rights are protected not just here in Wales, but throughout supply chains?

Jane Hutt AC: I thank Vikki Howells for that question, which she has already raised. It is an important one to repeat the Welsh Government's response to. We've introduced mechanisms to drive and support our work with responsible employers through the economic contract and the code of practice on ethical employment, but also accepting the recommendations of the Fair Work Commission, working across Government with social partners, employers and other stakeholders on their implementation. And it's very helpful that the Member has highlighted, already, good practice, because we can stand that in good stead in terms of driving better practice with other suppliers.

Thank you, Deputy Minister.

2. Business Statement and Announcement

The next item is the business statement and announcement, and I call on the Trefnydd to make the statement—Rebecca Evans.

Rebecca Evans AC: Diolch, Llywydd. There is one change to this week's business. Motions have not been tabled for the planned debate on the standards committee reports, so the debate will not go ahead tomorrow. Draft business for the next three weeks is set out on the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the meeting papers available to Members electronically.

I have close to 25 per cent of all Assembly Members requesting to speak and ask a question of the Trefnydd. I'll endeavour to ask as many as possible of you to contribute, but if you have three or four requests in front of you, you're only going to get your top one, so choose well. Suzy Davies.

Suzy Davies AC: Thank you very much, Llywydd.Okay, I'll choose this one. [Laughter.] As you know, Trefnydd, there has been some revived interest in the Swansea bay tidal lagoon, in particular in different ways ahead, for this fantastic idea actually proceeding in some way or another, one of which, of course, is based on pre-sales, so the strike price becomes less relevant, as a matter of public interest. Will it be possible for the Welsh Government to make a statement on its current position on the different options out there at the moment, in particular confirming whether or not the £200 million pledged for the original lagoon is still on the table, and what its views are on the pace at which Natural Resources Wales is trying to resolve the issue of marine licences? Thank you.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you for raising this issue, and I'm particularly pleased that there are still options on the table in terms of how a Swansea bay tidal lagoon could be taken forward. I'm really grateful to everybody who is working very hard to firm up those ideas. Certainly, when proposals are brought forward to Welsh Government, I can confirm that there is the possibility of that £200 million investment still being on the table. It will, obviously, depend on the project that is brought forward, but it certainly remains in our reserves at the moment, and, as and when there is further information, I'm sure that the Minister would be very keen to share it with you.

Bethan Sayed AC: I wanted to ask whether you have had any conversations with Neath Port Talbot council with regard to the decision to close Godre'rgraig Primary School after the Earth Science Partnership report reported that there would be a medium-level risk of a landslip. I know that local people there have been potentially alarmed, and even though the report says that the mountain hasn't moved, the school has been closed, and they feel that a lot of media attention has made them very anxious indeed. So, I want to understand what conversations you're having with Neath Port Talbot council about this, because the school is now closed and we don't know whether it will be reopened in September, and whether we can understand from the Minister for Environment, Energy and Rural Affairs or the relevant Minister what dealings you're having in relation to that particular issue.
I leave out my second issue, and the third one is, of course, that you've heard me every week raise here that I want to understand when you are going to make an announcement about the review of eating disorders here in Wales. I'm sad to say that we still have not had that announcement from the health Minister, and people are starting to lose patience with the Welsh Government in this regard. People have taken part in the consultation in good faith. They really wanted to see good services and to work with the Welsh Government on those services here in Wales. I really, really didn't want to see a written statement on Friday sent out after everybody had gone for recess, but, potentially, that may happen. Please can we have an announcement on the review of the eating disorders framework?

Rebecca Evans AC: I thank Bethan Jenkins, and I know of her strong interest in the issue of eating disorders, particularly her keenness to see the report coming forward. As I mentioned last week, I think, the Minister for Health and Social Serviceshas received that report, and it is a long, complex report. He has, I understand, met with officials to discuss it, and I hope that an update for Members will be forthcoming shortly.

David Rees AC: I'll keep mine short as well, Minister. You didn't actually answer the question about Godre'r Graig, which I think is important, because I also hope that you'll congratulate Neath Port Talbot County Borough Council for taking decisive action, because no-one wants to put their child at risk, and this report identified a risk that had to be addressed very quickly.
But my other question is actually on carers, and young carers in particular. The Health, Social Care and Sport Committee has done work into the aspect of young carers, but, unfortunately, because we want to get it right, we won't get the report out until the autumn. The Carers Trust has been in touch, explaining their deep concern over the delay from the Welsh Government in discussing its role in the young carers ID card that could be used. Can you ask the Deputy Minister to perhaps produce a written statement during the recess on young carers, who are leaving school this week for six weeks—not for a break, but six weeks of caring for whoever they care for; it's continuing—and going back into, possibly, an education environment in September, and they still won't know whether the Welsh Government's ID card system will be in place to help them? So, can you ask for a statement to tell us exactly what the Welsh Government's plans are and a timetable as to when they will enact those plans?

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you, David Rees, and apologies, Bethan, for not addressing the Godre'rgraig Primary School issue. I can confirm that we are in regular contact with the council to monitor the situation and will offer our full support if it is required. But, absolutely, as David Rees says, it has to be safety first for the pupils. But I will ask the education Minister to provide an update to both Members in terms of any discussions that we've had.
The issue of the ID card for young carers is potentially a really exciting development and I know that there is significant support for it amongst local authorities. I can confirm that Welsh Government officials met with officers from Welsh local authorities last week to work on an implementation plan for it. Clearly, there are several local schemes already in place, so it's important to implement a national scheme in a way that complements what's already in place, rather than complicating things further for young carers. The Deputy Minister for Health and Social Services is keen to keep Members informed and updated on the work as implementation progresses.

Mohammad Asghar (Oscar) AC: [Inaudible.]—to make a couple of statements. One is actually on the waiting time for ambulances in Royal Gwent Hospital, which is going beyond seven to 12 hours, which is totally unacceptable. Could the Minister for health make a statement?
And the second one, Minister, could you ask for a statement from the education Minister? The people who are having apprenticeships after their three years of college training or their learning—. After two years, if they go for an apprenticeship, they get the funding. After the three years' completion, there's no funding available.
And finally, could you make a great appreciation for the cricket England and Wales team? They won the world cup last weekend, and we'll be grateful— [Interruption.] I would be grateful if we set up our own Twenty20 cricket team in Wales. Thank you.

Rebecca Evans AC: So, I'll start with the most controversial of those issues and pass on my congratulations to the England and Wales cricket team for the excellent achievement.
In terms of ambulance response times, I will ask the Minister to provide an update, if there are specific instances that you have concerns about in specific hospitals. But it's worth remembering that WAST have met the ambulance response time target for the forty-second consecutive month, despite the rising number of calls, with performance on red calls above 70 per cent for the fourteenth consecutive month. So, there's certainly a lot of progress taking place in that area, but I understand that if you're one of the patients who is waiting longer than any of us would think was acceptable, then clearly that's very distressing. So, if you have specific incidents, I would encourage you to take them up with the health board, but also make the health Minister aware of them.
And on the issue of apprenticeships, can I encourage you to write to Kirsty Williams, who I know will provide you with a response before we come back?

Dai Lloyd AC: Can I first of all support Bethan Sayed's call and David Rees's regarding the closure of Godre'rgraig school and specifically what financial support is available from Welsh Government to Neath Port Talbot council? Obviously, it causes some excitement in some quarters. What financial assistance is available directly in this extraordinary situation of a closure of a school urgently?
And my most substantial part is that I would be grateful if you could bring forward on pest control enforcement in Wales, because, locally in the Mayals area of Swansea, residents are hugely frustrated that some of their neighbours are feeding the seagulls at their homes, and there has been a huge increase in the seagull population as a result, resulting in huge problems locally, including residents, children and pets being attacked all hours of the day and night. Now, residents are disappointed that Swansea Council has not taken any action against these residents who are feeding the gulls and attracting the gulls to the area. Now, we know that this is a problem in other parts of Wales too. Recently, Denbighshire County Council has taken a hardline stance in trying to mitigate the problem. If people feed the gulls there, even at their own homes, they can expect a letter warning them there will be legal consequences. Is it possible, therefore, to serve a legal notice requiring people to stop—it is possible, but it's not happening everywhere—feeding the seagulls? It's an inconsistent approach. Will the Welsh Government therefore commit to looking into this issue and issuing consistent guidance to local authorities?

Rebecca Evans AC: I thank you, and given the level of interest that there is in the Godre'r Graig issues, I think that perhaps a letter to all Members would be more appropriate than just to the Members who have raised it in the Chamber this afternoon.
On the issue of pest control, I'm familiar with the situation in Mayals. I have also had the same representations as you've had. The environment Minister has been here to hear the discussion, and I know that she'll look carefully at the different ways in which local authorities are dealing with the issue. You've given the example of Denbighshire. I know that Conwy is also taking a more strict approach. The Minister will look at the different approaches that local authorities are taking to address this issue.

Mike Hedges AC: I would like to ask for a Government statement on incineration. Many of us across the Chamber would like to see an end to non-medical incineration. Last year, the chief scientific adviser to the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, Professor Sir Ian Boyd, warned that further investment in energy-from-waste plants would stunt the UK's recycling rates. One way to extinguish the value in materials fast is to stick it in an incinerator and burn it. Does the Government agree with that viewpoint, and will they take action?
Also, very briefly, can I ask for a statement by the Minister for finance on transaction capital? I would hope that we could have that once a year, because there is over £1 billion in that transaction capital, and I believe that we, as an Assembly, have a right to know how it's being spent and how it's being paid back.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you, Mike, for raising the issue of financial transactions capital, which I know he also touched on in our supplementary budget debate last week. The Welsh Government doesn't welcome the restrictions that the UK Government has placed on our capital budget through the use of FTs. We are committee, however, to using the funding to invest in infrastructure and to boost economic growth in the long term.
As part of the budget documentation, we are committed to providing full details in relation to how FTs are used. Building on the information provided to you previously by my predecessor, I will certainly provide an update. But I can confirm that we are using it in innovative ways—so, funding, for example, for our land for housing scheme; funding for town-centre loan schemes and property funds; Green Growth Wales and green infrastructure. Projects that have benefited from it over time include the Barry Island strategic regeneration area link road, Cardiff Airport and aviation. We have also recently launched our stalled sites fund as well. So, we're looking for innovative ways to use the funding, and I look forward to further discussion in Finance Committee tomorrow, where we will be exploring capital funding.
I will ask the Minister to provide an update on incineration. I know that incineration plants are subject to stringent protective requirements of the industrial emissions directive, but I'm sure that she will provide further information in respect of the specific questions raised.

Mark Isherwood AC: I call for a statement on the Changing Places campaign for Changing Places toilets. This was launched in 2006, but last Friday, for the second time, I attended a Changing Places steering group meeting held in Shotton, focused on bringing Changing Places into the north-east Wales counties, hopefully starting with the town of Mold. It is chaired by Kim Edwards, who herself has Friedreich's ataxia. She said that, as it stands with the lack of current facilities, it means that people with a disability don't go out. Providing a proper changing place provides all the space and equipment, such as a hoist and a changing bed, amongst other items, needed to avoid people being changed on an unhygienic floor, not changed at all, or even not going out into the community in the first place. In my certain knowledge, it's 16 years since I first heard this raised in this Chamber, and yet people like Kim, today—16 years later—are still having to fight these campaigns. I'd call for a statement or even a debate next term on this matter.
Can I have a second item or not?

Very quickly, because some others are already—.

Mark Isherwood AC: Very briefly, on the new people's voice body for health and social care in Wales, you might be aware that the current community health councils have called for that body to be independent and genuinely stronger. However, on 3 July, the health Minister told the Finance Committee that the new body will
'have control of its own destiny and much more genuine independence in a way that CHCs at the moment don't have. And I appoint lots and lots of people to the boards of local and regional CHCs, which again I don't think makes sense.'
However, he seems to have forgotten that they will be appointing all the members of the new citizen's voice board whereas he only appoints half of the current community health council members, with the others appointed by the third sector and local authorities. Surely, independence must mean that very thing.

Rebecca Evans AC: In relation to the new body that will replace community health councils, of course the whole Assembly will have ample opportunity to explore this further and to debate the issue, and certainly there will be opportunities at Stage 2 and Stage 3 to amend the legislation, so I'd encourage Members to engage fully with that piece of legislation.
In relation to the request for a debate on Changing Places, or certainly an update on it, I recognise completely how important accessible toilet facilities are in terms of helping people access their communities and giving people dignity when they are out and about. I will find out the latest position in terms of the number of toilets that we know about, and how local authorities, businesses and others are seeking to ensure that toilet facilities are more accessible, but particularly with regard to Changing Places, which I know provides some additional appliances and so on.

Helen Mary Jones AC: I'd like to ask the Trefnydd first of all for a longer term plan to ask if the health Minister will bring forward in the autumn an oral statement to this Chamber about the progress of the independent oversight process in Cwm Taf maternity services. I'm very grateful, I'm sure, to him, and I'm sure all Members would agree with me, for a comprehensive written update that we've received today, but I'm sure that I won't be the only Member who would welcome the opportunity, when the autumn comes and the work is further progressed, to be able to question the Minister as a result of the statement on the progress that has been achieved.
I would also like to request that the Trefnydd asks the Minister for Health and Social Services to bring forward a statement about the transparency and accountability in the public appointments process. This is in the light of a statement made by the Deputy Minister on 6 June where she set out clearly the appointment process for the chair of the Social Care Wales board, and that was done in a written statement to this Assembly, and with detailed background of the members who had been appointed. Now, this is in contrast to the appointment of the new chair to Hywel Dda University Health Board, where a statement was made to the press with no detailed statement to this Chamber setting out the qualifications of the person who had been appointed. Now, it is interesting that the same individual was involved in both those appointments, and I think it would be helpful for this Chamber, Llywydd, for us to understand when we can expect to have detailed reporting to this Chamber of those public appointment processes, or whether we can be expected to learn about what, certainly for my constituency in west Wales, is an extremely major appointment simply from a press release, with no details available about that person's qualifications and experience. I will not name, Llywydd, the individual involved, but the Minister for health and, I'm sure, the Trefnydd will know of whom we speak. Concerns have been raised with me about that person's track record in previous places, and it would be useful for us to be able to see on what basis she has been appointed to the Hywel Dda board, just as we were able to see on what basis the members for the Social Care Wales board were appointed.

Rebecca Evans AC: On that second point, I'll give some serious consideration as to how we can ensure that we do make these announcements in a consistent way across Government, and in a transparent way, and give Members and other interested parties the opportunity to find out a bit more about people being appointed to boards and organisations, in order to get an idea of who they are and what their qualifications are. So, I'll give some consideration to how we can achieve more consistency there.
The Minister in his statement today, updating on the issues at Cwm Taf, has said that he'd be keen to provide a further update in due course. As we start to move towards the next term, obviously we'll be considering the balance of business to bring forward, and the request made today, and in recent weeks, will all be part of that.

Neil McEvoy AC: I declare an interest as a Cardiff councillor. I'd like a Government statement on private companies running children's care homes in Wales. They will not allow councillors, or indeed parents, access to those homes to visit. This has happened in one case in particular that I'm dealing with where a child has alleged abuse in care continuously—continuously—and neither councillors or parents are allowed to visit the home. There was an issue where the child was taken to hospital, and the only information given to the parents, who have parental responsibility, was that blood was involved. Nothing else—no further information was given. These private companies are making a fortune off these children, and this child is in the care of Cardiff Council, and I simply want to know how these private companies can get away with behaving like that and not allowing visits and not giving basic information about the condition of children in their care.

Rebecca Evans AC: Can I encourage you to write to the Deputy Minister for Health and Social Services asking for some more information, in terms of the role and responsibilities of private companies providing care, in terms of the access that they should give to interested parties in order to meet with and talk to children? It’s not a case I’m familiar with, but if you write the Minister, she’ll be able, perhaps, to provide some more advice.

Andrew RT Davies AC: Thank you, Presiding Officer. Organiser, could I seek three statements, if possible, please, and I will be very brief? The first one is on the equine flu that is, obviously, around Wales and around other parts of the United Kingdom, as I understand it. Many summer shows have already announced either vaccinated animals or no horses whatsoever will be in attendance at their summer show. It would be good to understand how the chief veterinary officer is recommending certain actions to Welsh Government, and what progress is being made, obviously, to contain this outbreak—a very serious outbreak I might add. And if there isn’t pertinent information at this time, given we are going into the summer recess, could I ask the Government to commit to publishing regular updates so that Members are aware of how this outbreak is being contained here within Wales?
Secondly, at the start of this term or at the end of the last term, there was an update on the Barry biomass boiler or incinerator—call it what you will. To date, I believe there’s been little or no progress since that update. It was some time ago—February 2018, and the organiser will be familiar with the times I’ve raised this—that the Government did commit to an environmental impact assessment being made available. I think it’s the Deputy Minister who’s responsible—Hannah Blythyn—because I can appreciate—I can see you looking round the front bench there. It would be good to understand, especially as we’re going into recess: is there any update on the action points that the Government brought forward in its letter? One thing highlighted in that letter was a breach of planning policy. It would be good to understand what interaction has happened between the Welsh Government and the local planning department—I declare an interest as a councillor in the Vale of Glamorgan, and, obviously, the Vale of Glamorgan is the planning authority in this particular instance. So, any update would be greatly received.
And, thirdly, it is important to understand what dialogue the Welsh Government have had in relation to the protests in the centre of Cardiff. I appreciate you’re not directly responsible at this moment in time, as it is a local authority matter and a police matter, but businesses and individuals have been inconvenienced greatly by the continuation of the protest. It is everyone’s right to protest, and it is everyone’s right to bring issues to the table and to the public’s attention, but many businesses in particular feel aggrieved that their normal trading has been greatly disrupted with no end in sight, and I’d be grateful to receive any update that Welsh Government might have, working with other partners, to address the concerns of the protesters and ultimately work with other authorities to bring a normalisation to the centre of Cardiff so that people can have their concerns addressed by the Government, but also that those with businesses and those who need to get about their daily activity can be confident that this disruption will come to an end.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you for raising those issues. In relation to the first: of course, equine influenza is a non-notifiable and endemic condition in the United Kingdom. The disease is usually mild and self-limiting, but it can also represent a major cause of respiratory disease in the horse population. I can confirm that the chief veterinary officer has been providing advice, and we’re in ongoing discussions with the Royal Welsh Agricultural Society, for example, and welcome their responsible decision for all equines attending this year’s Royal Welsh Show to be properly vaccinated against equine influenza. If constituents or interested parties would like information, I’m sure that the Minister will provide it, or they could seek information from their local vet as well.
In terms of the Barry biomass boiler issue, I’m afraid I don’t have any information for you today, but as soon as there is more information, we’ll provide that to you, even if that is during recess.
And on the matter of the protest in Cardiff, Welsh Government hasn’t had any discussions. It is really a matter for Cardiff Council, although we are, obviously, very much engaging on the substance of the matter, having recently declared a climate emergency and published our low-carbon delivery plan, setting out the actions and priorities that we will take to address this issue.

And finally, Siân Gwenllian.

Siân Gwenllian AC: Thank you very much. Recently, Rhun ap Iorwerth requested a debate on dentistry, and, in response, you said that the Minister for health may consider that. May I also echo that demand for a debate on dentistry, please, and that we have that early in the new term, and may I just explain why I’m making that call? The situation of dentistry in my constituency is very grave indeed. There isn’t a single practice in Arfon taking new patients on the NHS, not one taking adult patients, not one taking children, and not a single dentist taking children and young people with learning disabilities. My constituency is no exception. There are at least eight others in a similar situation. Clearly, that’s not acceptable and we need urgent action in terms of the contract and the cap, and the recommendations of the health committee need to be taken into account. As a long-term solution, the Government needs to look at training dentists in north Wales in Bangor, building on the medical training that's to commence there in September. So, I would welcome a debate so that we can air all of the problems that exist around dentistry in Wales at the moment.

Rebecca Evans AC: Well, I can confirm there'll be a debate on 'Designed to Smile: 10 years of improving children's oral health in Wales' on the first day back in September, so that might be an opportunity, at least, for colleagues to raise issues relating specifically to children's oral health, but, obviously, an opportunity to raise their wider interests and concerns.

Thank you, Trefnydd.

3. Statement by the First Minister: The Legislative Programme

The next item is a statement by the First Minister on the legislative programme, and I call on the First Minister, Mark Drakeford.

Mark Drakeford AC: Thank you very much, Llywydd. This legislative statement sets out the Government’s plans for the Bills we will introduce over the remainder of this Assembly term. Our intention is to help create a more equal Wales, rooted in economic, social and environmental justice.
We will press on with important measures in respect of education, housing and transport that will lead to improvements across Wales. We will strengthen local government and protect children’s rights. At the same time, we will press on with the essential preparations needed should we leave the European Union.

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, over the course of the last 12 months, through the efforts here of the Executive and the legislature, we have introduced, considered and passed an unprecedented volume of legislation, including more than 150 statutory instruments needed to correct the statute book against the possibility that the UK would have left the European Union by 29 March this year. It required a huge amount of effort on behalf of the Welsh Government, the Assembly Commission and Assembly Members to complete this programme of work on time, and I want to put on record my thanks to the very many officials, Members and committees that have made that possible.
Should we leave the European Union, we will acquire thousands of new powers and functions in policy areas that were previously set by EU laws. And that means, Llywydd, that the impact of leaving the European Union on our legislative programme is not yet over. The ongoing question about the manner of the UK’s withdrawal from the EU means no-one can predict with any certainty what the autumn will bring and whether and what sort of additional legislation may be needed. We have, however, been able to assess whether we are now in a position to bring forward a Welsh agriculture Bill and an environmental principles and governance Bill in this term, in the event the UK leaves the European Union.
We have consulted on environmental principles and governance in the context of Brexit. We remain committed to legislate to address the principles and governance gaps that will arise in the event that the UK leaves the European Union. However, this remains a complex matter and we are in ongoing dialogue with other administrations across the United Kingdom about how we can work collaboratively to achieve a coherent approach and we will continue to report to the National Assembly as the developing picture becomes clearer.

Mark Drakeford AC: In terms of a Welsh agriculture Bill, the delay in resolving Brexit means that we will now focus on the preparation of such a Bill in this Assembly term for introduction in the next. This will be an opportunity to be ambitious and wide-ranging, going further than simply confining legislation to farm support schemes to look at wider issues such as the rights of tenant farmers. My colleague, Lesley Griffiths, launched 'Sustainable Farming and our Land' last week. It sets out ambitious proposals for the future, including paying farmers for the actions they can take to respond to the climate emergency, reducing emissions and capturing carbon. I look forward to the conversations that will take place throughout Wales in agricultural shows and in other locations over the coming summer. Using the results of this consultation, we will bring forward a White Paper before the end of this Assembly term to pave the way for legislation.
Llywydd, while we have been preparing for Brexit, we have continued to legislate for important domestic matters, securing the administrative framework for our childcare offer to provide much-needed support to working families, and establishing a minimum unit price for alcohol, to be introduced in the new year. We have introduced legislation to protect children by abolishing the defence of reasonable punishment—a Bill currently being scrutinised by committees here—and introduced a Bill to secure key reforms to the health and care system.
Later today, I hope this Assembly will pass the Legislation (Wales) Bill, the first Bill of its kind in Wales, which will support the interpretation of Welsh legislation and improve the accessibility of Welsh law.
Llywydd, the last 12 months have also been noteworthy for legislation promoted here other than by the Welsh Government. The Public Services Ombudsman (Wales) Act 2019 was the first committee Bill to gain Royal Assent since this Assembly gained full law-making powers. The Llywydd’s own Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill has reached its amending stages. It will have far-reaching implications for this institution and for young people throughout Wales, as it extends the franchise in Assembly elections to 16 and 17-year-olds.
Turning, Llywydd, now to the coming year, the Government will also bring forward legislation to give the vote to 16 and 17-year-olds in local government elections as part of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill that we plan to introduce. That Bill will also strengthen local authority democracy, accountability and performance, and it will establish a consistent mechanism for collaboration and joint working, including arrangements for transport. This will empower local authorities to deliver modern, accessible, high-quality public services for and with the local communities they serve.
Llywydd, we will also bring forward in this next year a GP indemnity Bill to complement the current scheme, which was introduced in April. The Bill will ensure all clinical negligence claims, whenever they were reported or incurred, are covered by our liability scheme.
Llywydd, this National Assembly has taken many important steps to improve the private rented sector and make it a positive choice for tenants. Unfair fees charged by letting agents will be banned from September as a result of a law passed here. And I'm pleased to report this afternoon, Llywydd, that we can now press ahead with the implementation of the Renting Homes (Wales) Act 2016, which will ensure tenants have access to a wide range of benefits, including protection from retaliatory evictions.
But there is more that we can and will do, including responding to the widespread concerns about no-fault evictions. Last week, we launched a consultation setting out a series of proposals to extend the notice period landlords would have to give before they can take back possession of a property. Based on the outcome of that consultation, we intend to bring forward legislation in this Assembly term to address the no-fault evictions issue.
Llywydd, we will introduce a public transport Bill in this Assembly term, building on the proposals in the 'Improving public transport' White Paper. This Bill will be a key part of wider reforms to bus services here in Wales and it will help us to achieve our ambition of creating a truly integrated public transport network, planned and provided in the public interest, and which meets the needs of the travelling public.The White Paper also sought people’s views about a series of proposals to modernise the licensing system for taxis and private hire vehicles to respond to this rapidly changing market. Aspects of those proposals received clear support, but they also produced ideas, from the industry, from trade unions, from local authorities, to go further in addressing the challenges faced by the industry. These further ideas, coupled with developments at a UK level, have led us to conclude that more time should be taken to finalise our approach to taxis and private hire vehicles. Legislation on these aspects of the White Paper will now be brought forward the other side of the next Assembly elections.
Llywydd, this Government is committed to reforming and improving education in Wales. We have already made significant progress in relation to our ambitious reform agenda. We have changed the system for student support and introduced the most generous package of support in the United Kingdom for undergraduates, postgraduates and part-time students. We have changed the law to introduce a new education and support system for children and young people with additional learning needs up to the age of 25. We have reformed teacher training, and we have delivered the most ambitious programme of investment in our schools and colleges for more than 50 years. As part of this reform agenda, we have also made significant progress in developing our groundbreaking new curriculum, which will be rolled out in schools in Wales from September 2022. In order to ensure that that happens, we will now bring forward a curriculum and assessment Bill to set out in statute the principles, freedoms and structures for that new, ambitious curriculum.
And, in a separate Bill, Llywydd, we will also legislate to set up the tertiary education and research commission, to replace the higher education funding council here in Wales. The commission will strengthen national and regional planning, it will reinforce the link between research and education, and it will deliver a post-compulsory education and training system that is better placed to bring the sector together to provide genuine lifelong learning and skills for Welsh people.
Llywydd, as I announced last week, we will place social partnership on a statutory footing by bringing forward a Bill before the end of this Assembly term to enshrine the current non-statutory social partnership model in law and to ensure that agreements reached in social partnership are clearly enforceable.
These are the confirmed legislative ambitions of this Government for the remainder of this Assembly term.

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, to conclude, these plans will introduce positive and innovative improvements for the people of Wales. The Government's programme demonstrates that we are determined to drive forward ambitious plans until the end of this Assembly term, notwithstanding the uncertainty that we face. I commend this legislative programme to the Assembly. Thank you.

Paul Davies AC: Can I thank the First Minister for his statement outlining his priorities for the forthcoming year? Today, he has announced more of the same from this tired Welsh Labour Government. Last year, the former First Minister announced a range of new Bills, and where have we got with these? The ban on the use of wild animals in circuses is welcomed by the majority in this Chamber, but why has it taken so long to bring it to fruition? Wales used to lead the UK, if not the world, on animal welfare, and yet on this issue, and others, we have fallen behind Scotland and now England.

Paul Davies AC: And with the proposed changes to the community health councils, it is typical of this Government that, when something isn't going right, when people start taking it to task on its failings, it either scraps the target or abolishes the organisation that dares to speak up for individuals. And I put it to the First Minister: we need to boost accountability in our health service, not sweep failings under the carpet.
Now, it was extremely disappointing to me and the thousands of people in Wales who have autism or look after their loved ones with autism that this Welsh Government voted down the autism Bill, which would have brought much support to those families at a time when they need it the most. And I urge the Government to look again at introducing legislation in this area.
Turning to the new Bills announced today, it is good to see the First Minister taking best practice from the UK Government's Bus Services Act 2017 in his proposed public transport Bill by franchising bus services in Wales. However, what will the Welsh Government do to support, for example, provision of bus services for young people, and how will it support small and medium-sized bus operators through this specific legislation? Additionally, how will community-led bus services, which also fill gaps in provision, fit into the proposals for local authorities to franchise or run bus services directly?
Now, the harsh reality of the Government's mismanagement of the Welsh NHS is that patients and hard-working staff pay the price. It is unacceptable that nearly one in two patients find it difficult to make a convenient appointment with their GP, coming from a Government who campaigned to make GP services much more accessible. Given the farce in April, when GPs were left in limbo after the health Minister unilaterally cut the global sum of GP indemnity by more than £11 million to deliver the state-backed indemnity scheme, how will his Government seek to reverse such mistakes through this specific legislative proposal? Have both the British Medical Association and the Royal College of General Practitioners been consulted before this Bill was announced today?
Of course, no legislative programme would be complete without mentioning reform of local government, once again having the potential to leave councils, staff, and those who rely on local services in limbo again. The Minister for Housing and Local Government announced last month that recommendations from the independent working group on local government would be included within the Bill, specifically voluntary mergers of local authorities. How will this Assembly be assured that any proposal by local authorities would not be subject to the whim of the local government Minister, as actually happened back in 2015?
Given the continued protests today in our capital, it is disappointing that his Government is not bringing forward any Bill relating to the climate change emergency. However, this isn't surprising, as it seems his Minister declared it in the press first before updating him during any other business in Cabinet. This is a serious issue that needs serious consideration, and clearly we must spend time discussing this matter and then take clear action to work towards a zero-carbon Wales. Some people would suggest that this Government is paying lip service to their concerns on the environment, because if his Government was serious, then surely he would bring forward specific legislation as soon as possible.
Now, my disappointment continues that this Government has decided not to bring forward definitive proposals to ban single-use plastics in Wales. Can the First Minister therefore give us an update, or even confirm if it will be in this Assembly, for when he will be bringing in a ban, and whether he'll be looking to create a drink deposit-return scheme as part of that in the future?
Therefore, in closing, Llywydd, I look forward to scrutinising the Welsh Government's legislative proposals for the remainder of this Assembly. We as an opposition will work openly and constructively with the Welsh Government where we believe it's doing the right thing, and I hope that the Government will use its resources in the best possible way in order to produce legislation that will make a difference and will improve the lives of people here in Wales. I do hope the First Minister takes time to reflect over the summer on what policies Wales needs to make us an innovative nation, a nation that is ready to take advantage of the opportunities ahead and that, after 20 years of Welsh Labour, will finally start delivering for the people of Wales.

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank the Member for those remarks. I'll try and answer the questions that he posed in them.
The legislation we will bring forward in relation to bus services will be designed to reverse the damage done to bus services in Wales by the policies of deregulation introduced by his Government. That's where the problems of bus services lie. They lie in the denial of powers to local authorities to be able to act purposefully in the public interest, despite the fact that the vast majority of revenue received by bus companies in Wales comes in one way or another directly from the public purse. And he's absolutely right that the public should have confidence that the money that they provide for that service is being put to use in the public interest. That's what our Bill will secure and it will do that alongside the other things that we are already doing: extending subsidised travel on buses for young people and paving the way for the future of bus services by having demand-responsive services operating in parts of Wales, including new services being provided in the south Wales Valleys area.
As far as GPs are concerned, I notice that the Member failed to refer to the 93 per cent satisfaction rate that people in Wales express with their GP services. And, of course, the proposals that we're bringing forward in relation to liability are as a result of our discussions with the profession and with the medical defence unions. And, of course, the contractual matters to which he referred have now been settled here in Wales. We have reached agreement with GPC Wales on contractual reforms over the coming 12 months and those agreements are manifestly better than the deal that has been struck for GPs by his Government across our border—and that is the view of the profession.
As far as the local government Bill is concerned, well, the Bill will be here for Members to scrutinise. When we say 'voluntary mergers', the word 'voluntary' means what it says and the Member will be able to see that when the Bill is published.
As far as a climate emergency is concerned, then legislation is only one of the wide range of actions that this Government takes to make real our response to the impact of climate change on our planet. Here, Llywydd, are just three things that we will be doing and they demonstrate the breadth of the ambition that this Government has. In transport, we will press ahead over the next 12 months with our determination that 20 mph zones should become the default setting in urban areas with all the impact that that has not just on the climate but with every other advantage that it brings in terms of connected communities. We will bring forward regulations to tackle agricultural pollution, because we know that pollution in the agricultural industry directly harms our environment just as it directly harms the reputation of the agricultural industry. We will bring forward legislation in the form of regulation to deal with that in the coming 12 months. By the end of the next 12 months, Llywydd, the Welsh Government will have planted the millionth tree that we will have planted in Uganda on behalf of the people of Wales. We will create a forest in Uganda twice the size of the landmass of Wales working with our partners in the Wales for Africa programme there. That is part of our commitment not simply to the people of that area but the responsibility that we owe globally in relation to the climate emergency. All of those things—and that's just three examples; there are many more that I could have offered the Member this afternoon to demonstrate the things that we're doing. And by the way, Llywydd, I don't think I heard a single legislative proposal from the opposition that they would have put forward in the final period of this Assembly.
Finally, in relation to single-use plastics, Llywydd—[Interruption.] It's too late for them to start muttering these ideas now. The leader of the opposition had ample opportunity to set them out in front of the Assembly and couldn't find a moment to refer to them. As far as plastics are concerned, we have worked with his Government, we have worked with the UK Government, with the Treasury's consultation on proposals to use tax measures to deal with plastics. And we've agreed with the Treasury on the limited set of ideas that they have brought forward. Here, we have brought forward our own proposals for extended producer responsibility and a deposit-return scheme in Wales. The consultation closed in May of this year; we are considering the responses. We will publish a summary of those responses shortly, and then we will continue to work collaboratively with others to bring forward new taxation measures.

Adam Price AC: There are elements in the statement on the legislative programme that the First Minister delivered this afternoon that are to be welcomed. We’ve already declared our support for the principle of embracing the social partnership model that will be attached to the Bill that the First Minister has referred to.
We also welcome the move towards reregulation of the bus sector. We agree with the analysis in terms of the damage done by deregulation during the 1980s, and the shift in the other direction I think is a step forward. But may I ask, as this sector is one that is going through great and very challenging restructuring at the moment, for numerous reasons, what work has the Welsh Government done and what work is the Welsh Government doing to ensure that we aren’t simply waiting for those statutory powers or legislative powers? For example, I raised the issue of First Cymru with the First Minister a few weeks ago, and the opportunity—it’s a threat, but it’s also perhaps an opportunity—for us to ensure that we don’t see an erosion of services across large parts of the south-west of Wales, and across Wales as a whole. He did mention that he would have a word with his Minister for local government in order to have a discussion with the city of Swansea in the first instance.
In terms of taxis, I think it is a sector—. I think the First Minister in his statement said that it's a sector that is going through even more of a change, because of the challenges of the gig economy and so on, and perhaps that’s the driver for the ideas that have emerged from various stakeholders in this area. I am disappointed that we are delaying this, because this landscape is going to look very different in two or three years. It looked very different two or three years ago. So, can we afford to not take this opportunity to ensure that we place that sector on firm, robust ground?
There are things to be welcomed in terms of the legislation that’s been deferred. We welcome the decision to pause the agriculture Bill. That’s what we’ve consistently said in Plaid Cymru, and I think that gives us an opportunity to weight up and to develop a framework that will provide a foundation for the long-term future.
There are some things missing. I can’t see any reference, for example, to a clean air Act. I haven't read the First Minister’s manifesto for the leadership of the Labour Party from cover to cover, but I do think that was an element of the programme that you had presented—that is, an Act that would, for example, give you a statutory right to breathe, and would place a responsibility or put WHO guidance on some sort of statutory basis, and so on. And, of course, we know that there is a huge problem across Walesand this is an area where we do need to see progress. I would still urge the Government to reconsider not legislating now on this issue.
You had also mentioned, or in fact you had committed to extending the smoking ban, if I remember rightly, to open air areas in town and city centres. Is that still your Government’s intention, and when do you intend to legislate in that regard?
In terms of TERCW—I'm not sure what the Welsh acronym for that is yet—but I do think it’s true that this body will not only be responsible for tertiary education and research, but it will also be responsible for innovation in its broader sense. And if memory serves me, I think the intention is to create some sub-committee that will be specifically responsible for innovation and research. Isn't there a risk, First Minister, in that regard, because innovation of course relies upon research from the HE sector, and so on, but that only represents one aspect of innovation? There is also the business dimension, which is crucially important, and there was a recommendation made by Professor Kevin Morgan, who is a global specialist in innovation, that we should rather create a national innovation body on the Scandinavian model. That’s not what’s entailed in the recommendations that you're taking forward, but is that still part of the vision for the legislation that you are to introduce?
Finally, there is a reference in your statement towards legislative constraints. So, what exactly are those constraints? Is it the number of Members, the time available during the working week in the Senedd, which takes us back to the debate that we had last week? Does it relate to the number of civil servants that you have available to you? Can you give us some idea as to where the pressures are being applied and what can be done? We made one definite suggestion in terms of one element of this problem, but what else can be done? Because if these constraints do mean that there are good ideas for legislation that can't proceed, then we will all lose out as a result of that.

Mark Drakeford AC: May I thank Adam Price for his contribution this afternoon, and thank him for what he said about the Plaid Cymru support for the Bill that we're going to introduce on the social partnership model—and I look forward to the debate on that—and for what he said about reregulating buses in Wales? Of course, there are challenges facing the sector. We're not just going to wait for the new powers. There are many things that we can already do in Wales. I welcome the fact that there are 50 new electric buses that are going to be introduced in Wales over the coming months, and as I said in response to questions from Paul Davies, there are things that we're already doing with the powers that we already have to extend things, to draw younger people in to using the buses as well.
With regard to taxis, of course, things are moving very quickly. Things change in the world outwith the world of taxis. And the point on the gig economy, and so on, the unions had already raised those points with us and that’s one of the reasons why we want to think again and reconsider the new ideas that have been received. I do want to say, Llywydd, that we are going to prepare a package of things that we can do now with the powers that we currently have to respond to some of the issues that have arisen in the discussions on the White Paper.
On the agriculture Bill, now, over the summer, we are going to hold a conversation the length and breadth of Wales on the new paper that Lesley Griffiths has introduced, and, of course, as we thought about the first White Paper, to think about the things that people in this sector have to say to us. We're confident that we will have powers under the Bill currently going through the House of Commons to deal with the situation if we do leave the European Union, but we do want to bring forward a Bill that is relevant to us here in Wales, and we still want to prepare for that and publish another White Paper before the end of this term to prepare for the future.
With regard to clean air, we're going to publish a plan for clean air in the autumn and that will prepare the ground for legislation in this area in the future. With regard to smoking, we're going to bring forward regulations to extend those locations where we can control smoking, and do more in that regard. And that will lead to other things, as I already mentioned.
Just for a moment, Llywydd, I will expand on the tertiary education and training Bill—I'm not quite sure what that is in Welsh, I apologise—but just to explain the background to people again.

Mark Drakeford AC: Members will know it's the product of the Hazelkorn review. It recommended a single regulatory oversight and co-ordinating authority for the post-compulsory education sector, and we intend that the commission will bring together a range of currently disparate functions and funding streams and provide a transparent civic mission for the sector, as it covers higher education, further education, work-based learning, apprenticeships, sixth-form education and research and, as Adam Price said, innovation here in Wales. It's absolutely our ambition that we produce a single collaborative sector that is both ambitious and innovative, and the Minister will have heard the points that Adam Price has raised here this afternoon, and no doubt they will be further discussed during the passage of the Bill.
As far as constraints on our legislative ability are concerned, Llywydd, the biggest constraint that we face is Brexit and the demands that it has already made on this Assembly. There have been 130 written statements published by the Welsh Government in relation to statutory instruments alone during their passage through this Assembly. We've had those many debates, and I'm very grateful for the work of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee in its sifting role about the negative and the affirmative procedure that will allow this Assembly to carry out its scrutiny role. It's been an enormous constraint on our ability to pay attention to some other legislative priorities that we might wish to have brought forward and it's not over yet. I think I have announced this afternoon a programme that will place enormous demands on Assembly Members here in committees and on the floor of the Assembly, because of the ambitious volume of legislation that we want to complete during the rest of this Assembly term.
But I just want to take the opportunity of a point that Adam Price raised to say that all of this, to some extent, has to remain under review against the legislation that we may have to bring forward in an emergency way, should the United Kingdom crash out of the European Union in a way that we absolutely say must be avoided, and which then gives rise to unforeseen consequences that will require a legislative response. There are other constraints, of course, in terms of the availability of expertise, the availability of committee time, timetables of this Assembly itself, but Brexit is the single biggest constraint that we have faced over the last 12 months and I anticipate that it will go on being a constraint over the next 12 months as well.

Mark Reckless AC: The First Minister started his statement by saying:
'This legislative statement sets out the Government’s plans for the Bills we will introduce over the remainder of this Assembly term.'
I think it was about halfway through the statement before we got on to that. We heard before about what had happened or what others were doing or why you wouldn't be doing various things, and on those, you said, we've
'been able to assess whether we are now in a position to bring forward a Welsh agriculture Bill and an environmental principles and governance Bill in this term'.
I'm clear from your statement and, indeed, the pre-briefing of it—I'm not making a complaint about that—but just it is clear that the Welsh agriculture Bill is not going forward. You say, though, on environmental principles and governance:
'this remains a complex matter and we are in ongoing dialogue with the UK Government and the other administrations about the best way to achieve this.'
Does that mean 'no'?Is that Bill definitely not happening?
On the agricultural Bill, you talk about looking at
'issues such as the rights of tenant farmers.'
But this Bill is not going to come in until the next Assembly, and I thought, from your exchanges with Neil McEvoy previously, that you were already taking action in this area. Could you clarify?
On the climate change issues, we had Paul Davies making, I thought, very fair complaints about the way they'd been handled in Wales—an item of any other business after a press statement that had already been issued. But he didn't say anything about the way it had been handled at Westminster, where the UK Conservative Government gave 90 minutes of parliamentary time to a statutory instrument that wasn't even voted on, and on that basis, changing a target of 80 per cent reduction by 2050, which was coming some way to getting public buy-in and a degree of consensus, at least, relative to where we were, to something that I fear will not have that. And the Treasury and others in the UK Government have estimated costs of between £50 billion and £70 billion a year. They weren't even debated in Westminster, let alone voted on, and when we mention here that, for Welsh Government, they calculate that the cost will be £1 billion or thereabouts to the Welsh Government budget, you all just throw up your hands and say, 'You can't possibly do that,' while claiming it's such a priority. I mean, which is it?
I just wonder whether, with this statement, we have some movement. You talk about
'paying farmers for the actions they can take to respond to the climate emergency, reducing emissions and capturing carbon.'
So, the Welsh Government likes to say that it gets Wales £680 million a year—I think it's the figure you used—from the European Union. A lot of that goes to agriculture. Are you saying that a portion, and if so, how large a portion of that money is going to be changed from giving it to farmers on the basis of their land ownership, as long as they're actively farming to a degree, to saying they're only going to get it to compensate them for things that will cost them, such as climate storage or other actions on that? Is there a change of policy there and how much further how we got to go to find this £1 billion that we need to tackle the climate emergency that's been declared? Where is that money going to be found from?
You mentioned on childcare:
'we have continued to legislate for important domestic matters, securing the administrative framework for our childcare offer to provide much-needed support to working families'.
You don't go beyond the legislation. You've actually achieved this early. You had it in the Labour manifesto, and in this area, you've been as good as your word. You said there was going to be a focused rather than a universal childcare offer to working parents, and you've gone on and delivered it, and you've done it early. Before, the childcare system in Wales was relatively skewed towards the public sector, at least compared to England. Yet this scheme, I mean, it's not allowed top-ups, but it is in essence a voucher scheme, where the money goes to the parent to choose what childcare provider to use, and there's equality between the public and the private sectors. That's something you've actually delivered on, and I, at least, would like to commend you on that.
The GP indemnity Bill, again, I know GPs have been pushing very hard for this and were concerned that there hadn't been movement on it. There now is, and I think the Government's right to move in this area.
On the public transport Bill, we on these benches are open-minded about what's the best model for bus transport provision. We're not convinced that the deregulation we've seen outside London since the 1980s has been a great success, and we think it's right that we give local authorities the option to try franchising, to try direct provision. Would the First Minister agree with me that it would be advantageous if—? I think there's a trade-off to be had in terms of encouraging regional working where it's needed, but also, would it be advantageous if we saw some local authorities or some regions, at least, taking a different approach, so we got some further evidence of what works, and seeing what approaches are more successful in dealing with what customers want in this area?
It doesn't mention the joint transport authorities, and one area where there was a lot of criticism of the White Paper was around the joint transport authorities, and particularly having regional ones, and then having a national one. And while I think Members were keen to give a following wind to Transport for Wales and understood it being a private company in its operation, what is the point of these regional and national JTAs, and isn't there a danger of duplication? What decision has been made in terms of how we'll legislate in this area?
And then we have the curriculum and assessment Bill, and the social partnership. I think a week or two ago we heard from the First Minister his enthusiasm for socialism in one clause through commencing this part of the Equality Act. My concern there is around the assessment element in particular of the education Bill. It talks about freedoms, but will that be schools marking their own homework? What is being removed in terms of assessment and accountability for schools? And is the First Minister saying that, as well as socialism in one clause, if you want to push ahead with trying to implement socialism, perhaps the first thing socialists do is stop measuring things so they can't be seen to fail?

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, I'll try and respond to a number of the points raised. I don't think it's possible to understand the next year's legislative programme without some account of the measures that are already in the pipeline and the workload that falls on this Assembly in order to complete them, and that's what I was trying to do in my statement.
As far as the agriculture Bill is concerned, we will continue to consult, now, over the summer, on the proposals that my colleague Lesley Griffiths set out last week. Our aim is to reward active farmers for two essential purposes: for sustainable food production, and for delivery of those public goods that, without help from the public purse, farmers would otherwise be unable to deliver. Our aim now is to bring that together in a single sustainable farming scheme. Now, I think that has been broadly welcomed by the farming unions, and I think they think that it is a genuine response to the concerns that they raised during the consultation on 'Brexit and our land' of having two separate schemes, where in fact we want to provide a single sustainable farm income for those farmers who are active farmers, that they don't simply get rewards on the basis of the amount of land they occupy, whether they do anything with is or not, and I think again that's something that the industry welcomes, and we want to make sure that the investment that the public makes in our agriculture industry, which we are very keen to make sure we go on making, is an investment on which the public see a return for those environmental purposes that the Member mentioned.
The GP indemnity Bill is a very good example of how, when Governments act on behalf of a group collectively, we are able to put the force of the Government behind a really important need in an occupation. I could describe it as a socialist solution to what was otherwise market failure, and I don't think I would be that far wrong from it. Last week, I thanked the Member for his generous endorsement of our social partnership Act as 'socialism in one clause', but he's been good enough to repeat it this afternoon.
As far as bus transport is concerned, I think we would go further than saying deregulation has not been a great success. I think we have seen deregulation damage bus services across Wales. We see competition on that relatively small number of profitable routes, and money being therefore drained away from local authorities' ability to go on supporting bus services on routes that will never survive on an entirely commercial basis. We want to be able to avoid that wasteful competition by giving local authorities the powers they need to provide a planned bus service that delivers for the wider public good. How they will do that—I don't think we have any objection to the idea that local authorities will come up with different approaches, but we think that those different approaches should be regionally mapped out. I entirely can see why a regional approach to bus services in the south west of Wales would be different to a regional approach in the Gwent area of Wales. So, it's not a difficulty with differentiation, but it is a feeling that bus services don't operate on local authority boundaries. To plan a bus route, you need to be able to plan how that bus route operates across the boundary, not just within a local authority. That is why, in our proposals for bus transport and in our proposals for local government, we will bring together a set of proposals to support the regional development and delivery of bus services, because we think that simply makes the most sense, in the way that the industry operates on the ground.

Mick Antoniw AC: First Minister, I will confine my comments, I think, to the references to the social partnership part of the legislative programme, because I think this may be one of the most underplayed parts of what is, I think, a very visionary agenda. One of the prime objectives of any Government is the well-being of its people. In Wales, we have unemployment falling from 7.7 per cent eight years ago to 4.4 per cent now, to some of the lowest levels we've had in generations. Yet, the level of in-work poverty remains the same. It must be fundamental to any society that, if someone does a good week's work, they should be entitled to a decent standard of living and they should be entitled to a reasonable standard for their families as well.
The International Labour Organization says that dialogue and equity are at the heart of collective bargaining and help to build stable and decent societies, and that collective bargaining can create a fairer economy. I want to welcome that particular part of the legislative programme, but also to put on record the actual socioeconomic importance of this. This is visionary legislation, which is also legislation being recognised across the UK and, indeed, further afield as being fundamental to one of the biggest challenges we face within our society, and that is socioeconomic inequality. So, I welcome that. I wonder if you could perhaps give us an indication of the timescale for the process of this legislation. Beyond that, I think this will perhaps become one of the jewels in the crown of Welsh Labour's legislative programme.

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank Mick Antoniw for that. He's right to say that I didn't spend a great deal of time on the social partnership proposals in today's statement, Llywydd, largely because I had an opportunity on the floor of the Assembly last week to make a statement specifically on that matter and to answer questions from Members then. At the heart of our social partnership ambitions is to create what the well-being of future generations (Wales) Act commits us to, and that is the creation of a more equal Wales. It isn't just the ILO that points out that more equal societies do better economically. That is the conclusion of both the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund as well. And they both say that more equal societies with more successful economies are created when workers have a fair share of the product of that economy, and the collective bargaining through trade unions is the way that people come together to secure that fairer share. So, our social partnership Bill will be a fair work Bill as well, because that is absolutely part of our ambition for a more equal Wales.
I thank Mick Antoniw for what he said about the interest, which I know is being taken beyond Wales, in the Bill. I said here last week that on the following day, on Wednesday of last week, I would be meeting the social partners, and that we would work together in a social partnership sense to plan the progress to the introduction of the Bill on the floor of the Assembly. I'm happy to report this afternoon, Llywydd, that that meeting took place, that it was a productive meeting, that we would work together on the social partnership agenda, including preparation for the Bill, and that we remain, as a Government, committed both to its introduction and to its passage during the remainder of this Assembly term.

Suzy Davies AC: Perhaps I can invite the First Minister, first of all,to perhaps hold a debate on our legislative programme at some point, just to prove that there actually was one, and of course there have been several policy announcements since then.
Thank you for your statement, though. You began by saying:
'We will press on with important measures in respect of education…and transport'.
So, I suppose my first question has to be why you're not bringing forward a new Act to replace the outdated Learner Travel (Wales) Measure 2008, not least to protect the aims of your 2050 strategy for 1 million Welsh speakers, which hasn't been reflected elsewhere in the announcement you've made today. But at least that would be one way of securing access to Welsh-medium education at all ages.
Thank you for acknowledging the work of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee in your statement, and its work on statutory instruments, but I hope that you recognise also the frustration that was voiced by that committee in terms of the lack of scrutiny that that process afforded us during the Brexit SI saga. That, I hope, will not creep into any further processes that we might encounter when it comes to our ability to scrutinise.
I know that Members will be disappointed with the delay in the made-in-Wales agriculture Bill. I don't want to go into that particularly, but please bear in mind, Members, that that was put in front of us as a reason for accepting the LCM Bill at the time, when primary legislation is always preferable. Now, primary legislation is preferable, but it needs to be functional, so can you give us an idea, First Minister, on just how 'framework' your primary legislation is likely to be in character? We've already had to put up with a fair few Swiss cheese Bills in this Assembly, so I'm looking for reassurance that all Bills will be fully researched upfront with complete clarity on key concepts, expected outcomes and implementation, with only genuinely technical matters referred to secondary legislation. It was nonsensical that the minimum alcohol price was missing from the minimum alcohol price Bill, and Members should not be ready to accept such underdeveloped legislation in the future.
I hope that we don't see anything similar in the curriculum and assessment Bill. Welsh Government is aware that there are still some residual concerns on how to translate the areas of learning experience into the real teaching experience, so I'd be interested if you have any detail on how that's going to be addressed in that Bill. This legislation is to enable huge change aimed at wiping out or at least reversing the recent history of underachievement, and we acknowledge that something needs to change, but on this legislation we are going to be very alert to the fact that it absolutely must not allow for disguise or places to hide. So, will the Bill set out how accountability of schools is to be provided for?
And then, finally, First Minister—and thank you, Llywydd—on both education Bills, but all Bills, actually: draft Bills. We like those in this Assembly, so can you confirm that it will now be the norm for us to receive draft Bills for scrutiny prior to the formal laying of Green Papers? Thank you.

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, I thank Suzy Davies for that. I look forward to the Conservative Party here using one of its very many debates that it has here in its own time to bring forward the legislative programme that it says it would introduce were it ever to be so unlikely as to be in a position to do so here in Wales. It would be a short debate, I understand that, but we look forward to it.
I understand the points that Suzy Davies has made about the tension between the need for proper scrutiny here and the speed with which we were having to deal with the volume of Brexit-related legislation. Part of the frustration was because we had to bring forward our SIs after UK Government SIs were in place, because often what we were doing depended upon what they were doing first, and the delays in them bringing forward their SIs had a knock-on effect on what we would do here. That is very much the case in relation to the agriculture Bill. When the UK was due to leave the European Union on 29 March, with more than two years of this Assembly term still to go, we were confident that we would have had everything in place that we needed to bring forward our own agriculture Bill. That is certainly not the case now. We may be leaving on 31 October—who knows? We hope not, of course, but even if we do, the amount of time that would be left in this Assembly term simply means that it is not feasible, as we thought it was before the UK Government's original plan went down in flames, when we thought that we would be able to do that.
I recognise the tension, of course, between what goes on the face of the Bill and what we leave to secondary legislation. And no doubt we will debate that, the balance, in all the Bills that we bring forward. But the example that the Member chose to highlight demonstrates why some of the claims that are made about the need for things to be on the face of the Bill are simply not sensible. In my view, it would have been genuinely nonsensical to have put the price of a unit of alcohol on the face of the Bill, because, every time you needed to change it, you would have needed fresh primary legislation. That would be—[Interruption.] Well, David Melding tells me, 'No, it wouldn't'. David, Suzy Davies is shouting at me, 'Yes, it would'. So, I think maybe you two should have a conversation first. Some things are rightly in secondary legislation, which is scrutinised on the floor of this Assembly, and a detail of that sort, when prices will change, inevitably, over time—putting it on the face of the Bill was not, in my view, the sort of detail that belongs there. It’s properly—[Interruption.] It's properly brought forward through regulation and regulation is properly scrutinised on the floor of this Assembly. So, I see this will be a debate that we will continue as each Bill is brought forward. But I do want to recognise it’s a proper debate, a proper debate, and I recognise that we will have to have it each time as to what is properly on the face of the Bill and what’s properly left to regulation, even when we disagree about where the line might be drawn.
As to the point that the Member made about accountability, I really think this is another fault line on the floor of the Assembly. The culture we want to create in our public services is one of high trust, in which we recognise the professional expertise of people who work in these services, and we work with them to create the outcomes that we want. I don’t want a culture of mistrust, and that’s what I heard the Member outline—that sense of accountability is always being suspicious of what people are up to in our public services, always feeling that they have the spectre of the Welsh Government sitting on their shoulder for everything they do. That’s not what I think of as accountability, and I certainly don’t think it produces good public services.

Finally, Llyr Gruffydd.

Llyr Gruffydd AC: Thank you very much, Llywydd. May I welcome the fact that the Government is now not going to bring forward an agriculture Bill for Wales before the next election? It’s certainly something that I and Plaid Cymru have been arguing for over the past few weeks and months. I do feel that we should wait to see what the post-Brexit trading landscape looks like—that is, what access will Welsh farmers have to markets, will the level of tariffs be detrimental to the industry, and, indeed, how much funding will be available from the UK Government through the Welsh Government to support the sector in Wales—before we proceed to implement any recommendations that emerge from the consultation that has just commenced. Introducing changes like these isn’t something that you do without serious consideration—you're aware of that. It’s only once in a generation that such far-reaching changes can be introduced, so it’s important that we turn over every stone and consider all possible options before proceeding. I always felt that the Government timetable was unrealistic, and I am pleased that the Government has now recognised that from a legislation perspective.
The current consultation, of course, closes a day before Brexit may happen, at the end of October. Then we will need to consider the options and the responses. Then we will need impact assessments and we need to model the impact of the Government’s proposals on the sector. Then we need to design programmes with the sector, and then draft the legislation. So, it was always very ambitious to do that before 2021. But what I would like to ask about this specifically is: now that we have more time within the timetable, as the Bill itself isn’t going to be introduced before the next election, can you confirm to us that the Welsh Government won’t carry out the impact assessments and the modelling on the sector until we know what Brexit looks like? Because you said yourself some moments ago about the unforeseen consequences and that we are entering grounds that we couldn’t perhaps imagine. The reality is, if you’ve done the modelling and the impact assessments before Brexit happens, then it is premature, because we won’t know whether the context will reflect where we are post Brexit.

Llyr Gruffydd AC: I'm a bit confused in relation to the environmental principles and governance legislation. It was touched on earlier. I'm rather disappointed, I think—no, I am; I am disappointed—that the Welsh Government seems reticent or unlikely to pursue distinct legislation on environmental governance for Wales. You seem to suggest that maybe you were looking to the UK Government to do it for you, initially. Of course, that runs counter to what we've been hearing from Government up until now, because we've been told that the environmental policy landscape in Wales is very, very distinct, is very different—the legislation and the duties that we have stemming from the Environment (Wales) Act 2016, from the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, puts Wales in a very, very different place to the rest of the UK, and particularly to England, in what we require in terms of environmental principles and governance captured in any post-Brexit accountability mechanisms.
Now, of course, we all remember that Natural Resources Wales was created as a bespoke Welsh solution to Welsh needs. Your own Government is currently pursuing an independent planning inspectorate for Wales because of policy divergence between England and Wales that necessitates that distinct Welsh body. My fear is that retrospectively latching Wales onto UK legislation around, or proposals around, the office of environmental protection runs contrary, clearly, to that. I can understand the rationale for a UK-wide governance body, replicating, effectively, what we already have on an EU level—and I've got something to say about that as well, as you can imagine—but I'm not convinced that that kind of approach would be based on a partnership of equals and, of course, it would necessitate all devolved administrations coming to the table. And, from my understanding, there's no appetite for that in Scotland at the moment. So, we're likely to end up with an England-and-Wales body, and RSPB Cymru and other organisations have made it clear in evidence to the environment committee that that would be the worst of all worlds, because, as we've seen in other contexts, their fear is that we'd likely see a concentration of work on where the resources are greatest and, in their words, that is most likely in England. So, do you recognise that risk, if we were to end up with an England-and-Wales body? And will any belated arrangement with England—because, of course, the UK legislation is already well on its journey through Westminster—really respect devolution and existing Welsh law, and is there not a risk that we end up, therefore, with the lowest common denominator?

Mark Drakeford AC: I thank Llyr Gruffydd for what he said on the agriculture Bill. Of course, we did want to continue with the agriculture Bill in this term. The problem isn’t with what we wanted to do, but with the timetable for Brexit itself. In the new context, I agree with what Llyr said: there isn’t enough information to legislate in this term, and there won’t be enough information in the new Brexit context. That’s why we’ve taken the decision to bring forward a White Paper. And, of course, we are going to work very hard with the sector to draw things together, to listen to the sector before October, and work with them again after October, when we have received all of the responses.

Mark Drakeford AC: It's not a matter of stepping back from the ambition, Llywydd, because our ambition for the future of Welsh agriculture is real, and the changes that we want to bring about I think will go with the grain of those ambitious people in the sector.We can't do impact assessments without knowing the budget. The Member is right about that, and we won't be going ahead with them until we are clearer about the budget we are working within.
On the environmental principles and governance gaps, I felt a slight Mark Isherwood moment coming on: 'How do you answer confused of north Wales, who has said to me that—?' Well, I will try and clarify any confusion by being clear: we do intend to legislate in this field here, yes. We don't think we will be able to rely entirely on legislation elsewhere. It would not be acceptable to us or to the Scottish Government either to have an England oversight body simply operating at a UK-wide level. We're still involved in many conversationswith all administrations, not just the UK Government, but the Scottish Government as well, about where the gaps will finally emerge in relation to governance and principles. That's why it wasn't possible this afternoon, Llywydd, to be certain about when legislation would happen. But, if it wasn't clear in what I said that we intend to legislate, I'm happy to confirm that in answer to Llyr's question.

One final succinct contribution—Alun Davies.

Alun Davies AC: You're very kind, Presiding Officer. I'm grateful to you, Presiding Officer, and I'm grateful to the First Minister for the statement this afternoon, and I want to welcome that statement, especially the focus on equality, which has run all the way through that.
It's important, I think, when Westminster's deciding whether it can even sit or not in the autumn, whether MPs will be allowed even to sit in their own Chamber and debate the matters facing us as a UK, that in this Parliament we are actually focusing on how we're going to improve the lives of the people we represent.
I want to especially welcome the statement on legislation on bus service regulation. This is something that the First Minister will be aware I've brought to the Chamber on a number of occasions, and has a significant impact on the people of Blaenau Gwent, and it is something that will have a very warm welcome across all parts of Wales.
I also want to welcome the confirmation that the Government is moving ahead to legislate to lower the franchise in local government elections. I think this is something that has very strong support across the whole Chamber. I hope that the First Minister will also be able to confirm that that change in the franchise will also be extended to prisoners on at least short-term sentences.
I also want to welcome the continuing radical reforms of education. This is something that, again, will be warmly welcomed in Blaenau Gwent, and it's something that I know puts a mark of radicalism on this Government.
There are some areas, First Minister, where I do have some concerns. You will be aware that I'm very concerned that the Government has dropped all Welsh language legislation now. If we are serious about equality, then it is clear that there is a glaring gap in equality legislation for those of us who use the Welsh language. I do not understand how the Government intends to achieve its objective of a million Welsh speakers without a statutory framework within which to operate. If that is not forthcoming before the next election, I am seriously concerned whether that target will possible to achieve. 
Secondly, the First Minister will not be surprised to hear that I'm profoundly disappointed that he's not moving ahead with local government reorganisation. This was a manifesto commitment of Welsh Labour. Every Welsh Labour Member in this Chamber was elected, as was I, with a firm commitment to this as a part of our manifesto. So, walking away from that manifesto commitment is something that I'm extremely disappointed in. I want to see—[Interruption.] I want to see—. When we talk about equality, I want equality in delivery of services as well. We're about to hear a statement from the finance Minister on public spending in the future. We know that we cannot continue with a structure of governance in Wales that was put in place by John Redwood. So, I'm disappointed about that.
I'd like to complete my questions to you, First Minister, by repeating some of the points that have already been raised about those areas of legislation that may be affected by EU exit. I recognise and I accept the assurances that have been given over areas such as fisheries, agriculture and the environment. However, I would be very deeply concerned if any of these areas were legislated for in Westminster. This isn't a matter of legislative convenience or for any sense of resource issue; it is essential to us that there is firm Welsh legislation in place, enacted by this place, that will enable either this Assembly or a future Assembly to ensure that whatever measures are put in place are measures that have the support of the people of Wales, and are enacted by people sitting here representing them.

Mark Drakeford AC: Llywydd, can I thank the Member for his questions? I'll take them in reverse order, if I can. I think he has described the Welsh Government's approach completely accurately in relation to EU legislation. There will be some times when, for sheer, pragmatic reasons, we will have to rely in a transitional way on powers that are created in UK legislation, but that is simply a path to legislation that will be brought forward on the floor of this Assembly, not only in agriculture,but in fisheries as well. In fisheries in particular it's important to wait until the UK legislation is put in place, because it will extend the powers of this Assembly very significantly in relation to fisheries, and we will want to bring forward a fisheries Bill that allows the Assembly to consider and legislate across the range of new powers that we will have. But that is absolutely our intention.

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Ann Jones) took the Chair.

Mark Drakeford AC: I hear, of course, what the Member says on local government reorganisation. His views are well known on the floor of the Assembly, if, I'm afraid I'd have to say, perhaps not quite as widely shared as he may once have hoped. Our Bill will not leave local government in the John Redwood position. It will provide radical new ways in which local authorities will be able to exercise new powers and will be able to act together in a statutory way to discharge functions on that regional basis.
As far as the Welsh language is concerned, we have, as he knows, six sets of regulations that cover 120 different bodies already, and the standards that they introduce, and the compliance with those, are monitored by the Welsh Language Commissioner. The message I hear back whenever I am talking to people is not about the need for the standards to be the main focus of our attention, but the implementation of those and the use of those—the use of services by people who speak Welsh, through the language of their choice, and to encourage people to use the services that are now available. Now, when announcing the decision not to go ahead with the Welsh language Bill, Eluned Morgan announced that the programme of introducing standards for new bodies would restart, and the next step in that journey will be for new standards to be introduced for healthcare regulators and for the water companies in Wales. So, we're certainly not not doing things in that Welsh language space, because of our commitment, which I know the Member very powerfully shares, to reach our ambition of a million Welsh speakers by 2050.
I thank him for what he said about the radical nature of our education reforms, about our determination to press ahead with extending the franchise to 16 and 17-year-olds, and, indeed, to people from other parts of the world who live in our local authority areas and have a stake in the future of those local authorities.
He's absolutely right to identify bus services as an equality issue. It's true; we know that when we talk about train services on the floor of the Assembly, there is often a lot of excitement about them. Bus services don't attract the same sort of public attention, and yet far, far more people use bus services, particularly the people that he was talking about in his contribution. That's why we have decided to put our focus unambiguously on bus regulation during this Assembly term, because it is, in the way that Alun Davies said, the thread that runs through the legislative programme. It puts equality front, centre and at the heart of everything that this Government wants to do here in Wales.

Thank you very much, First Minister.

4. Statement by the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd: Future Outlook for Public Spending in Wales

Item 4 on the agenda this afternoon is a statement by the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd on the future outlook for public spending in Wales. I call on the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd, Rebecca Evans.

Rebecca Evans AC: Dirprwy Lywydd, there is little doubt that Wales and the public services we value so highly face major challenges as we look to the future. It seems the sole focus for the UK Government is the election of a new leader of the Conservative Party and, as a result, a new Prime Minister. We have all heard both candidates make big promises on tax and spending. But, as things stand, we know very little for certain about what fiscal policy a new Prime Minister—and almost certainly a new Chancellor—will pursue. On top of the escalating uncertainty around Brexit, this lack of clarity around the UK’s fiscal prospects creates an unprecedented challenge for us in developing spending plans for the future. In spite of this, I am committed to sharing as much information as possible with stakeholders to inform their future planning.
At this point, Wales faces the twin threats of the UK Government’s continuing programme of austerity and a 'no deal' Brexit, which could do great harm to Wales's interests. We are now in the ninth year of austerity and Wales is suffering the consequences of damaging Tory policies. We have long maintained that continuing with austerity is a political choice. It is a fact that, in spite of sluggish growth, tax receipts more than cover current public spending. What have we got to show for almost a decade of austerity?UK productivity is barely above pre-recession levels and pay, adjusted for inflation, still remains below 2010 levels. Growth in tax receipts has been sluggish, reducing resources to fund public services.In Wales, if spending on public services had kept pace with growth in GDP since 2010-11, this year the Welsh Government would have an additional £4 billion to spend. To put that into perspective, it would increase our budget by nearly 25 per cent.

Rebecca Evans AC: The UK Government’s narrative has been that austerity is ending. The reality is very different. Even taking into account announced increases to health spending, real-terms spending on public services per head across the UK will be some 10 per cent lower in 2023-24 than in 2009-10. Make no mistake, the UK remains firmly in the grip of austerity. The Welsh Government has made very clear that health will continue to be our priority for available funding. But the stark reality is that, unless the UK Government takes steps to end austerity, protecting health will mean very, very tough choices for other vital areas of public services.
Based on the Office for Budget Responsibility’s published figures for the spring statement in March this year, we estimate that, if the Wales resource budget increases in line with UK resource departmental expenditure limits and NHS growth in England is matched in Wales, then the rest of the Wales budget would fall by around 1 per cent in real terms between 2019-20 and 2020-21.This would heap further pressure on our hard-pressed public services, which are still facing rising inflation and unfunded pay and pension costs.
But the frightening reality is that the public spending context could get even worse.It's worth remembering that the spring statement forecasts assume a relatively benign Brexit. Unbelievably, we still have no clarity about how the UK will leave the EU and what the future holds. The next few years will crucially depend on the form of any Brexit deal and any transitional arrangements. And that, of course, assumes that there will be a Brexit deal.
Wales receives some £680 million annually from EU funds, and the Welsh Government has made it clear that we will look to the Treasury to maintain our spending at current levels post Brexit. At present, the consultation on the proposed UK Government shared prosperity fund, which threatens to sweep power away from Wales, has not even opened. We will continue to hold the UK Government to the promise that we will not be a penny worse off. Our message is clear: not a penny less, not a power lost.
We are already seeing the impact of Brexit uncertainty on our economy. The Office for Budget Responsibility, the Bank of England, the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development and the International Monetary Fund have all highlighted that Brexit uncertainty has pushed the economy onto an even lower growth path. Business investment decreased in each quarter last year—an unprecedented development outside of a recession. GDP decreased by 0.4 per cent in April compared with March. A disorderly Brexit would risk recession in the short term.
The Office for Budget Responsibility has also noted that the losses of tax revenue due to slower growth are more than offsetting any savings that result from reduced contributions to the EU budget. This damage is not only a matter of abstract economic statistics. The UK Government’s own analysis suggests that each person in Wales could be well over £1,000 per head worse off than otherwise each year over the long term. This will be reflected in lower pay, worse job prospects and poorer public services as a result of weaker tax revenues. This uncertainty is damaging the economy and directly impacting our ability to plan and provide the longer term certainty for the Welsh public services that people rely on. We start this year with our current revenue settlement not extending beyond the current year, 2019-20, and a capital budget only until 2020-21. Based on current policy, we can only assume that the net impact of growth in devolved tax revenues and growth in the block grant adjustment between 2019-20 and 2020-21 will not have a substantial effect on growth in the overall Welsh Government budgetary position between the two years.
Public sector pay makes up around 50 per cent of the Welsh Government's spending. So, developments that impact on public sector pay bills are key when developing spending plans. The UK Government’s policy of austerity has resulted in a long period of restraint in public sector pay since 2010. While this has helped mitigate some of the worst impacts of austerity, we think that public servants should be properly rewarded for the important and difficult work that they do. Having seen the UK Government agree the teachers’ pay and the three-year NHS 'Agenda for Change' pay deals, we now expect that pay per head will rise more quickly over the next few years, but this will also mean an increasing pay bill. Coupled with increased pension costs at a time when budgets are not rising, meeting these costs will prove particularly difficult.
Having confidently stated that it would set budgets for three years through a comprehensive spending review, the UK Government is now indicating that because of the chaos it has created it is increasingly likely at this stage it will be forced instead to play for time and roll forward revenue plans for one year only. We've always sought to provide the earliest possible certainty on budgets to our partners. I've now written to the Chairs of the business and finance committees signalling that this uncertainty has left us with no choice but to plan on the basis that we will publish a draft budget on 10 December and the final budget on 3 March. While this might be the normal budget timetable in Scotland, I'm aware of the impact that this timetable will have on the Assembly and our partners. It remains possible that the UK Government could publish an earlier budget, and in that scenario, I'll be looking to bring forward our budget timetable as much as possible, and I'm grateful for the Business Committee’s support with this.
We're determined to maximise the impact of the resources we have. We're focusing our budget preparations on our eight priority areas of early years, social care, housing, skills and employability, better mental health, decarbonisation, poverty and biodiversity. These priority areas are integrating activity across Government in the areas where we can have the greatest impact over the long term. As part of this work, I'll be undertaking visits over the summer in relation to these areas to gain an insight of the challenges and the opportunities that wider partners see in each of these eight areas. So, in closing, our Government remains committed to doing everything it can to meet the very real challenges we face today and in the future.

Nick Ramsay AC: I must say, I'm not entirely sure where to start with this statement today. In his previous contribution to the previous statement, the Minister emeritus, Alun Davies—. I'm not sure whether you're going to contribute to this statement, Alun, but you mentioned that you were looking forward to hearing some spending commitments. I'm not sure we really did hear much about any Welsh Government spending commitments in this statement, but then it did follow on from the previous statement about priorities.
The silly season has clearly started early this year. All I can say is that it's disappointing that this statement lacks the Minister's normally constructive tone with her normally positive overtones. This statement was more about UK Government bashing rather than putting forward that positive Welsh Government vision that we all in this Chamber would like to see, that public services and those working in public services across Wales would like to see, and, of course, the public would like to see. I think that this, in that regard, is an opportunity that's been missed. In fact, it wasn't until halfway through the statement—I do thank the Minister for giving me sight of the statement in advance—but it wasn't until halfway through the statement that we got on to EU structural funds, which have been so important to the Welsh economy over so many years. Indeed, it was only at the end of your speech that you did actually then touch on priorities, but only in a very general sense as you spoke about going out to stakeholders. As for,
'Our message is clear: not a penny less, not a power lost',
well, it does sound a little bit like a Jeffrey Archer novel, but I would say that I do actually agree with the sentiment myself. I think many AMs here would agree that we don't want to see a penny lost, and we've made that statement over a number of months now, and years. But I think that the message was sadly lost in some of the wider UK Government bashing that occurred.
Yes, of course, we recognise that the Welsh Government faces challenges and the UK Government is far from blameless in all of this, but rather than constantly blaming the UK Government for the nine years of austerity, Minister, have you considered laying at least some of the blame at the door of the previous UK Labour Government that built up the debts far too fast and went far too far in building up those debts? And perhaps—I used to say this to the previous finance Minister—perhaps if the Welsh Government had been running things then instead of your Labour cousins in Westminster, we might have been in a slightly better position. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Unfortunately, you weren't, and we do now see the result of that profligacy at that time.
Turning to some of the detail that was there on the Office for Budget Responsibility's published figures for the spring statement, you said,
'if the Wales resource budget increases in line with UK resource departmental expenditure limits and NHS growth in England is matched in Wales, then the rest of the Wales budget would fall by around 1 per cent in real terms between 2019-20 and 2020-21.'
Is that a coded way of saying that Welsh Government has no intention of matching funding increases with the NHS in England? Because if that is the case—and I recognise you say, as well, it would cause reductions elsewhere in other budgets—but if that is the case, then I think we need to be upfront with the public that the NHS budget in Wales is not being protected in the way that some people think it might be, and protection, indeed, that the Welsh Conservatives argued for back in 2011, which didn't happen back then in real terms. It happened in cash terms, not in real terms, and I think that we are still playing catch-up here in Wales from the mistakes that were made back then.
On the budget timetable, I fully agree with the Minister that three-year budgets set through a comprehensive spending review are desirable, and it's a shame that the UK Government doesn't feel able to introduce them at this point. I would point out that it was this UK Government that at least aspired to do so. And as the Welsh Government knows, and we know on the Finance Committee, three-year budgets are not easy to achieve. I would ask you: are you confident that you are delivering the sort of medium-term stability that public services in Wales are crying out for, and are you hopeful to move to commit to three-year budgets?
You finally mentioned Welsh Government priorities at the end of your contribution. I wonder if you could give us some more details on that, also on your planned visits that you mentioned over the summer. It does remind me a little of the former finance Minister Jane Hutt's budget tour. Alun Davies remembers, and this emeritus remembers the budget tour of a number of years ago, where she went out and visited stakeholders in different corners of Wales—a very comprehensive tour, actually. I remember her coming to my—I think she went everywhere, actually, but Jane Hutt, as you know, is very diligent in that respect. Is it your intention to re-invoke the spirit of that tour? Which stakeholders do you intend to meet with? Will it be, to coin a phrase, 'the usual suspects' or are you actually intending to go out and maybe take some evidence from stakeholders who aren't normally engaged with, so that we would see over the months ahead something that I think all AMs here would like to see, which is a budget that genuinely reflects not just the interests of Assembly Members here, but the interests of the people of Wales and is beneficial, indeed, to the future economy of Wales?

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you. I'm pleased to have the opportunity to respond to those comments. There weren't spending commitments made in this statement today because the purpose of it wasn't to make spending commitments, it was to outline the outlook for future public spending in Wales in advance, then, of coming forward with commitments within the envelope that we will have. I think it's really important to have these opportunities to set out the situation because I think it is time for a reality check in terms of the difficulties that we're facing. So, there was no good news in the statement; it was a series of facts that are quite unpalatable to many of us, but they do reflect the situation as to where we are.
On a like-for-like basis, the Welsh Government's budget now is 5 per cent lower in real terms than it was in 2010-11. This is a political choice; this is a choice the UK Government has made in terms of austerity, and I think that we're more than within our rights to point that out. So, when people ask me, 'Can we have extra funding for x,y and z?', I need to know where it's coming from because we can't have a balanced conversation that doesn't involve that.
But then looking forward, we're looking in extremely difficult times: the Office for Budget Responsibility forecasts prepared for the spring statement showed growth will continue to disappoint for the next five years. GDP per head is expected to increase at an average annual rate of 1 per cent compared to a long-term average rate of 2.4 per cent. The Bank of England has provided an updated forecast for the economy in May that focuses more on the near-term look, and that says that, over the next 12 months, we expect only modest growth in GDP of 1.5 per cent. And both of these do so in the context of modelling for an orderly Brexit, so I think that we really need to get a good grasp on just how serious this situation is and the level of difficult decisions that are facing us.
In terms of stability, I would absolutely love to provide organisations with stability. I've met with the third sector network and I meet regularly, with my colleague Julie James, with the finance sub-group of local government and we would dearly love to provide some kind of certainty to those organisations, but unfortunately, all we have is uncertainty at the moment. So, we don't have a budget for next year. I've had to, as I said in my statement, write to the Chairs of Business Committee and Finance Committee signalling that we have no choice but to publish a draft budget on 10 December and the final budget on 3 March—circumstances as they are. And those are the very latest dates that we can do so and Standing Orders do require me to notify the Finance Committee as to when we would publish those documents.
I think, moving forward, some kind of certainty from the UK Government would be very welcome, but I am becoming more and more convinced that we will be looking at a rollover budget for next year. Both of the candidates for Prime Minister suggested that they could bring forward a budget in September, so we would look with interest at that. Whether or not that would be a budget that gives us some certainty for the longer term, or whether it would just be a kind of election budget with some giveaways for high tax earners, as I think some of the candidates had suggested, remains to be seen, but whether it would be of any use to Wales in the context of ending austerity is very unlikely.

Llyr Gruffydd AC: I don't share Nick Ramsay's jovial outlook, at the moment, I have to say; I think austerity is causing all sorts of problems and untold damage to individuals and communities, and the erosion of support and services to people across Wales, and, of course, there's not much prospect of change in that respect. Only in May, Paul Johnson, the Institute for Fiscal Studies director wrote in a report, and I quote:
'Leaving the EU would most likely increase borrowing by between £20 and £40 billion in 2019-20. Getting to budget balance from there...would require an additional year or two of austerity at current rates of spending cuts.'
So, prospects aren't as good, maybe, as some people would wish they were. And, of course, we can add to that the concerns as to whether Wales will be receiving replacement funding from the UK Government for what we're currently in receipt of. I mean, they made promises around the pensions issue, which was highlighted to be misleading, because we didn't get the money at the end of the day. So, there are real concerns, but, of course, I don't want to hear from the Minister what the problems are; I know what the problems are. What I want to know is what are you doing to address and tackle some of those issues. So, what negotiations are you having with the UK Government in relation to future funding? We know the ambiguity or the evasion around committing to the shared prosperity fund. Well, what are you pursuing, therefore, to ensure that we get some sort of clarity?
Lesley Griffiths, the rural affairs Minister, told us only a couple of weeks ago that she had no idea how much money she was going to get, if any money at all, if there was a 'no deal' Brexit. So, we just need assurance from you, as Minister, that you are leading the charge from the front and not just shrugging your shoulders and saying, 'Well, we don't really know what's going to happen and it's all doom and gloom.' I think we need to hear that, actually, you are taking the fight to the UK Government.
Now, Boris Johnson's recent comments around what he would like to do with money being spent in Wales is also cause for concern, of course, and I'd like to know what you're doing to ensure that any UK Government infrastructure spend is actually complementary to Welsh priorities, because there is a danger that we end up with some sort of incoherent financial posturing between the Welsh Government and the UK Government trying to outdo each other without it being joined up, really, and we need to make sure that you do work coherently in order that we get the best bang for our buck.
Focusing on the Welsh Government plans to release its own budget, of course, we were hoping to see a bit more of a definitive shift in terms of responding to the climate emergency in the supplementary budget published previously. I understand it's a tidying-up exercise, is what people tell us, so I am hoping that the next budget that will appear at some point in the autumn will show a palpable shift in terms of resources to address the climate emergency. We haven't seen any costingsto the Government's low-carbon delivery plan, of course. I'm just wondering, given that the future generations commissioner did some work on last year's budget that identified that only 1 per cent of that budget was actually earmarked for direct action to tackle climate change, whether we will see, as I say, that palpable shift in terms of resources towards decarbonisation as well. I'd like to hear from you what your plans are in that respect.
I also want to ask about multi-annual budgets. I know that the Welsh Government isn't afforded that luxury by the UK Government at this moment in time, but, of course, we do see in Scotland the Government there include aspects of multi-annual budgets in their budgets. Most recently, they included multi-year allocations for early learning and childcare and digital connectivity, so I'd like to know whether the Welsh Government will be incorporating elements of multi-annual budgeting in your next budget, despite, of course, doing that in very difficult circumstances.
Finally, you say in your statement that health will continue to be your priority for funding. Well, what I want to know is how will your budget further pursue a preventative approach, because, again, the future generations commissioner has highlighted how 94 per cent of NHS spending in Wales goes on acute and tertiary services. So, are we going to see that starting to change as you put that greater emphasis that you tell us you want to put on the preventative approach?
Of course, the ultimate preventative approach, I suppose, is to invest more in education, ensuring that our children and young people grow up being more aware of the importance of their own well-being, healthier lifestyles, being socially responsible citizens, understanding what environmental impact their actions might have. So, when will the Welsh Government confront the funding crisis in our schools, and will you ensure that schools have the resources they need to be able to deliver those outcomes that we all want to see?

Rebecca Evans AC: I thank Llyr Gruffydd for those comments. The first point he made was: are we taking the fight to the UK Government? Well, yes, I took the fight to the Prime Minister just last week. I was representing Welsh Government on the EUExTP meeting, which is the European Union exit and trade preparedness committee, which is a sub-committee of the UK Cabinet, which Welsh Government and the devolved administrations have the ability to go along to. So, I made the points at those meetings that, actually, we have not had a conversation yet in terms of what funding might be forthcoming for Wales in the event of a 'no deal' Brexit. I made the point that it is extremely unsatisfactory that we are facing the genuine prospect of a 'no deal' Brexit without having had those conversations or any certainty from the UK Government there. So, the UK Government is not confused about Welsh Government's position in those respects.
Of course, we always attend these meetings and make the case for Wales across the piece. The shared prosperity fund, for example, I've taken that case up again with James Brokenshire after the unanimous vote that we had here in the Assembly where we all supported the motion, which was jointly tabled by three of our parties, which said that we didn't want a penny less, that we had to make sure that the shared prosperity fund wasn't an opportunity to roll back on the devolution settlement, and that decisions on that fund should be made here in Wales. Some work has gone on over the last 18 months that would set out very clearly what Welsh Government's priorities would be for the future of regional funding, so we would be looking at multi-year frameworks, we'd be looking at the greater opportunity for local communities to have a say in the direction of the decisions that are made around those regional funds. So, we've been very clear in the documents that we've published and the work that Huw Irranca-Davies has been undertaking in thegroup that is looking at the future of regional funding in Wales as well.
In terms of Boris Johnson's comments, he said that we wouldn't have less money, so we welcome that, but he also said then that regional funding in Wales post Brexit would benefit from Conservative influence in terms of value for money. Well, of course, the Public Accounts Committee has looked at Conservative influence and value for money, and has looked at one of the funds that it has administered locally, and found that there were no real outcomes to that funding. So, I don't think that we can be taking lessons from the Conservatives on value-for-money issues.
The climate emergency issue is very live and very real for all of us. We're having these discussions now, as we start to consider the preparations of our next budget. But let's not imagine that good work hasn't been going on in this area for years. So, by the end of thiscurrent Government term, we expect to have nearly £70 million invested in public sector energy projects, with an expected £650 million in cash savings on energy, and to reduce emissions by 2.5 million tonnes of carbon dioxide over the lifetime of those assets. We're already considering carbon impact when allocating capital funding, and this was a key factor, for example, when we invested £50 million to develop a new rail station in Llanwern, together with extensive park-and-ride facilities and line improvements. And as part of our midpoint review of the Wales infrastructure investment plan, we've provided £60 million over three years for the NHS all-Wales capital programme, including supporting the replacement of the ambulance fleet with more modern, lower carbon models. So, it's not as if we just suddenly woke up one day and realisedthe environment was important. This has been at the heart of all of this Government's work, and we do recognise that within the context of emergency we need to increase our ambitions and move further forward there.
The preventative agenda—we worked really closely with the well-being of future generations commissioner to agree a definition of 'prevention', which is one that we're using across Government now, and, clearly, we want to see more investment in prevention, because obviously it has savings in the longer term, but that doesn't mean, of course, that we don't have the acute end to meet as well. Good work is going on with the future generations commissioner's office in terms of developing that journey checker that we've been talking about, which shows how we will better embed the future generations Act in all of our budget-making and decision-making processes. And some mention has been made earlier on today about the future generations commissioner's report, where she suggested £1 billion of funding for what she would see as priorities for the next budget. Now, that's a really useful contribution to the discussion, and I look forward to meeting with her to discuss that further. I think that the challenge to the commissioner, and the same challenge I make to all Members and everyone else I have discussions with regarding the budget, is if we're asking for additional funding in one place, then we have to have an understanding as to where we disinvest in response to that. And I'm also keen to understand the exact details of the carbon emissions that we would expect to be saving as a result of those measures in the 10-point plan that the commissioner produced, but I'm looking forward to having those more detailed discussions with her shortly.

Vikki Howells AC: I'd like to thank you, Minister, for your statement, which offers us a stark warning of the challenges ahead of us, challenges that are made all the more pressing because of the failed economic policies of the UK Government. I'd welcome your reflections on the dangerous hyperbole that we've seen from the two candidates for the leadership of the Conservative Party. You've alluded to some of this in your answers to other Members, but I'd like to specifically ask you whether you agree with me that the evidence, for example, from the Institute for Fiscal Studies, is that Boris Johnson's offers on income tax and national insurance contributions would actually deliver the greatest benefit for those on the highest of incomes in this society, and do you agree with me, also, that this would see a further slashing of the funding available to public services across the UK, and, of course, here in Wales?
Minister, you have explained to us the high degree of uncertainty around future spending plans, and this uncertainty is clearly made worse by the lack of a comprehensive spending review. With that in mind, how exactly is that affecting the ability of the Welsh Government to plan alongside partners in local government, business and the third sector?

Rebecca Evans AC: I thank Vikki Howells for raising these points, and particularly the recognition that some of the policies and proposals that have been put forward by both potential new Prime Ministers certainly are not on the progressive end of things, and certainly would benefit those who are richer, and offer nothing for people who are struggling, but then I suppose that is very much where we are in the sense that they're playing to a very narrow gallery. They only need to satisfy the small number of people who are members of the Conservative Party so that they can walk into No. 10. And, clearly, being progressive and trying to introduce policies that will support people who are the hardest pressed, in difficult times, who are bearing the brunt of austerity, is not a priority for them.
We're trying to do some modelling along different paths, looking at things that might happen so that we can get a better understanding of what that means for Wales. So, we're not expecting to know the quantum of our budgets until much later in the year, but we are looking at various scenarios, and they do vary from some favourable conditions to some very stressful ones. And one of the ones that we're modelling is about preparing for a 'no deal' exit from the European Union. In December of last year, we published our latest economic analysis of the UK Government's proposals for EU exit, and that highlighted, in a worst-case scenario, GDP maybe between 7.75 per cent and 10 per cent lower than in May 2016 by the end of 2023, in the event of a disruptive Brexit. This is a more severe contraction than was experienced in the recession that started in 2008. Subsequent analysis from the bank suggests that suitable mitigation preparation could alleviate the worst-case impact somewhat, but it would still be similar in scale to the last recession. So, I can reassure the Member that we are modelling all kinds of possible outcomes, and certainly looking very carefully at the impact that the various promises made by the Conservative prime ministerial candidates might have on Wales.
Vikki Howells is right to identify the fact that we don't have a comprehensive spending review and we don't have a budget for next year as being really at the root of the lack of clarity that we have. So, were we to see a roll-over budget of one year without the additional funding that we've had in year, for example, that would mean, on a like-for-like basis, local authorities would be £111 million worse off on that basis. So, I think the challenges that we're facing are very stark, and the lack of information is just making things difficult.

Mark Reckless AC: When I was planning for this week's business, I think it was Friday last week, I was taking a look through some of what we'd be doing and I saw this statement, 'Future Outlook for Public Spending in Wales', and I was quite excited. I thought we were going to be looking at some of the big, long-term issues affecting public spending in Wales: the demography of Wales, our ageing population, the impact of when we lose younger people to England. What can we do to keep more of the younger people generating taxes in our economy, particularly when we've got the Welsh rates of income tax now? Why is our population ageing so much, relative to England? Do we have levers, and would we want to consider using any of those levers to affect, perhaps even at the margin, the demography? What are those challenges? How are Welsh Government preparing for it? But instead, we get this. I mean, what a whinge. We've just had a long litany of complaints, as though, looking forward a decade, we're going back a decade, and it's just a great screed against austerity. We were told that there is a continuing programme of austerity from the UK Government, that the UK Government's narrative has been that austerity is ending, and that the reality is very different. And then you treat us to this comparison between 2023—well, at least that's looking forward. But you go back to 2009-10. I mean, what does that say about whether austerity is ending? Surely, what matters, at least in that respect, is: what's our budget this year compared to last year? How might it be next year compared to this year? Is there a change in trend? Are we actually going to begin having a bit more money again? Yet, all you talk about is austerity, and I just don't think that it's very helpful. [Interruption.] Well, if you'd like to examine my voting record, you'll find that some of them I didn't actually vote for.
But, I mean, let's—. The one good thing if Boris does come in is that, perhaps, there will be some optimism. That's one thing that you can say for him. Whether it will be well grounded or not, we will come to see. You said nothing positive, at least that I recall, in that statement. This morning, have you looked at the economic numbers that came out today? Seventy-six per cent employment across the UK—an absolute record. We've never seen employment on that scale before. And we have wages going up by 3.6 per cent year on year. That's more than we've seen—significantly more than we've seen—for the last decade. In real terms, that 3.6 per cent increase, inflation at 2 per cent—. We're now seeing real wages going up year by year between 1.5 and 2 per cent, yet we're still seeing employment creation on top of that. So, if you look at both employment creation near 1 per cent still, year on year, and that 1.5 to 2 per cent real wage growth on top of that, you could be looking at growth in employment income this coming year of 2.5 to 3 per cent in real terms. Surely that gives the scope for GDP to surprise to the upside compared to some of the gloomiest forecasts that you've been talking about. We've also seen, at least at the UK level—you don't give us the numbers here—some surprises to the upside in terms of how the borrowing numbers have been coming in. One of the key drivers of those borrowing numbers is that employment income. It is hugely important to the tax take, and some of the areas—the only ones you talk about—where the economy's disappointed, for example investment, are ones that are not the big tax-take areas. If you have a certain level of GDP, if you see a shift away from investment towards employment income, at least in the near term the fiscal impact of that is very positive, because you raise more tax from it. We didn't hear anything about that at all, and I have to say I am disappointed by that approach.
You have this Jeffrey Archer sort of title, Nick Ramsay suggested—not a penny less, not a power lost—and, again, you accentuate the downside. You could at least have listened to your First Minister in the previous statement. He was a lot more positive. He said we'll be acquiring thousands of new powers and functions in policy areas that were previously set by EU laws. Surely that is something to celebrate. Clearly there's a discussion with UK Government and others about exactly how the shared prosperity fund will work. Now, Boris has said that the decision to cancel the M4 relief road needs to be reversed, and he's said there's going to be significant Conservative Ministers' influence on how the money is spent, so I infer from that that the UK Government may be offering to pay for the M4 relief road, or at least a substantial proportion of it. Now, surely, given the impact that could have in boosting our economy, helping young people stay in Wales—what better way to boost shared prosperity than actually to fund that M4 relief road?
Isn't it time the Minister started actually looking at the positive, at least some of the positive elements? I'm quite happy to plan for scenarios that are less positive, but the Bank of England numbers she's quoted—they were the worst-case scenario to start with, and they've revised them away because they're preposterous. They are based on the assumption that people don't respond to changes in economic circumstance, whereas they do, and that's what drives human progress. So, let's just have a bit of optimism.

Rebecca Evans AC: I'm not going to pretend there is good news in terms of Welsh Government's budget, which has been going down year on year. Just three facts from Mark Reckless's contribution—well, one from my statement, and two from his contribution. The fact from my statement is that 50 per cent of the Welsh Government's budget goes on pay. Mark Reckless tells us wages are going up year on year; Welsh Government budget is going down year on year, so I'll leave Mark Reckless to do the maths in terms of what that means for the pressure on Welsh Government and the difficult choices that we have to face.
The chief economist has provided a report, as he will do again this autumn, which we'll publish alongside our draft budget, and he takes the longer look. The latest report contains a range of important conclusions, including that Brexit continues to weigh on growth prospects for Wales and the UK as a whole. The severity of the impact will depend on the form that Brexit takes, and the dislocation associated with the process of leaving, and it's likely that Wales will be disproportionately hit by a hard Brexit. Analysis undertaken by the OBR implies that the assumption of a prolonged period of fiscal restraint should remain at the core, central scenario, and under the lower scenario, which is included in the report, the Welsh Government would only recover to its 2010-11 level by the end of the next decade. So, that takes a longer look, and, again, there's not a lot to be particularly joyous about in that as well. So, I'm sorry if the Member thinks that it's a whinge, but, unfortunately, I'm sharing some facts with colleagues that I think will help us in terms of our deliberations as we set our forthcoming budget.

Rhianon Passmore AC: Thank you, Minister, for your statement, and I remain in no doubt that austerity is a politically motivated camouflage for an ideological attack on the state and public sector by the UK Conservative Government, and I make no apologies for saying that. It is critical to the context and outlook for Wales and the people of Wales, which is the statement that we have just heard. And I'm afraid the Assembly group opposite do belong within the UK Tory family, although they do try and distance themselves from it like a rather weak and wobbly distant relative that they really just don’t want anything to do with on occasion. So, Minister, I’ve heard it said by the Tory benches that I mention austerity a lot, and that is because it does make me angry. I make no apologies for that either. As the Assembly Member for Islwyn, I will continue to mention austerity.
I’m increasingly concerned that the situation, though, is being made a lot worse, as the Minister has said, by the UK Government’s ongoing lack of a comprehensive spending review, the lack of clarity making planning virtually impossible, and that this compounds the impact of the ongoing austerity. It compounds the cuts to Wales, and it does not even countenance the economic crash and harm of a ‘no deal’ Brexit, which seems to be somehow not countenanced by some in this Chamber. So, Minister, can you set out further your view on how the cumulative impact of these constraints are impacting on our ability to act, despite the highly ambitious and innovative programme of legislation?

Rebecca Evans AC: I thank Rhianon Passmore for setting out the challenging circumstances in which we find ourselves, but I want to emphasise that Welsh Government is doing absolutely everything it possibly can to prepare for Brexit, whichever form it takes, and to try and take whatever mitigating action we possibly can. So, you’ll recall I recently announced a capital investment package, which was a first tranche of a stimulus package worth £85 million: £50 million of that was invested in social housing to support the delivery of up to 650 affordable homes across Wales, which could create employment for up to 1,000 people for a year; £5 million allocated to the maintenance of the Welsh Government’s strategic road network, ensuring well-connected, reliable, resilient road networks in all parts of Wales; and £10 million was allocated to the economy futures fund to support the delivery of the economic action plan, and this additional funding will help boost resilience and sustainability for Welsh businesses and encourage inward investment in a post-Brexit environment. And then there was an additional £20 million for local government capital funding, and we will work closely with our local authority partners to ensure that that funding is deployed in the most impactful way.
So, we're doing everything that we can to support businesses, especially in these times of uncertainty, and we'll shortly be making an announcement of further funding that will be made available through the EU transition fund, which colleagues will recall is a £50 million fund that aims at helping businesses, organisations and society in Wales to transition through the Brexit process. Over £35 million of that has now been allocated, but, as I say, I’ve been having some discussions with colleagues as to how we can best deploy some further funding there. So, Welsh Government's working extremely hard in difficult circumstances to provide as much certainty as we can to business and as much assistance as we can to our communities.

Finally, Alun Davies.

Alun Davies AC: Thank you very much, Deputy Presiding Officer. I must say, this has been a somewhat disappointing statement, Minister. We all know that the UK Government’s austerity policy has been a disaster for Wales—it’s been a disaster for public spending—and we all know that it’s had a human impact on people across this country as well, and people that the Minister and I both represent. However, what we do not know, and, unhappily, we still do not know, is what Welsh Government is going to be doing about this. What is the response of Government? We expect more from Government, and I think we've every right to expect more from Government than simply making faces at the opposition here, the Government in Westminster, and speeches condemning the Tories. Certainly, people in my constituency want to know why are we electing people to come here. We want more than speeches; we want more than resolutions.
I recognise the numbers that she has alluded to this afternoon in terms of Brexit, but that, of course, reinforces the demand and the requirement for action and an approach from Government that goes beyond rhetoric. We know nothing about the evolving tax base. We know nothing about how the Welsh Government is approaching a potential erosion of that tax base. We know nothing about an approach to taxation policy. We know nothing about the Welsh Government’s approach to borrowing. And we know nothing about how the Welsh Government expects to use the Welsh reserve. Public spending now lies here as well as in Westminster, and, as somebody who has campaigned for devolution all his adult life and has campaigned for responsibility to be held in this place and not simply the other end of the M4, it's profoundly disappointing when the Government's response to these challenges is simply to blame someone else somewhere else. We have to take responsibility for these issues here as well.
Minister, we heard from the First Minister in an earlier statement this afternoon that he does not intend to press ahead with our manifesto commitment on local government reform. So, left with the Redwood model, a pre-devolutionary governance in a country that's changed beyond all recognition, we now have the prospect of spending more administering a system of governance that didn't work when we had more funding available to us during the Blair Governments in London. And this demands more from the Welsh Government. I will want the Welsh Government to seriously consider how, then, in this context, are we going to protect core services. Are we going to say—I use this as an example, Minister—that we're going to fund schools directly, that we will directly fund schools from Welsh Government, or that we will fund schools through the consortia? Because it frightens me that we have a radical reforming agenda for education, but we don't have the funds available to pay teachers or teachers' assistants or support staff within schools in order to deliver the basics.
So, I don't think it's enough in the future to simply blame the Conservative Government in Westminster. I accept completely the arguments over austerity, of course I do; I've made similar speeches to the Minister in the past. But I will say to the Minister that, for the future, when she comes back from her budget tour over the summer, I think this Chamber will expect far more from her than simply an attack on a failing Conservative Government.

Rebecca Evans AC: So, I know that Alun Davies would have read with interest the 'Tax policy work plan 2019' that I published in February this year and will have some detailed questions for me on that. And that set out the programme of work and research that the Welsh Government is pursuing in 2019, building on the findings, of course, of last year's work plan. And that policy sets out our main areas of interest and it's there so that organisations and interested individuals can see what we are examining, they can ask questions and contribute their views, knowledge and experiences to inform our thinking. And, of course, when I published that, I did invite everybody to involve themselves with that tax policy work plan.
He'll also be familiar, I'm sure, with the Wales Centre for Public Policy's research that it's done on growing our tax base here in Wales, and that's something that we're very much focused on. Of course, some of the promises made by candidates for the Prime Minister in policies will not help us grow our tax base here in Wales, but our focus is very much linked with our new national development framework, which the Minister for Housing and Local Government will be publishing shortly. And that sets out how we can use the levers at our disposal to ensure that we are encouraging people to come to Wales who are coming here because they're able to do so because they know that Wales is a good place to do business, a good place to set up business, and a good place to create jobs, which will help people maximise their own income potential.
And we're also working to develop personal learning accounts, for example. This is part of our budget process, which I'm undertaking a gender review of. Those personal learning accounts will be there for individuals who are in relatively low-paid, low-skilled jobs at the moment but really want to move on, want to gain some skills and have ambition to move into higher paid jobs. Those are pilots that we're looking at through the lens of a gender budgeting approach. And that's a new approach for us, which we're learning from Iceland, which has been working for seven years on its gender-budgeting approach, and we're keen to see how we can take that forward in Wales.
Certainly, I've spoken to the Member before in committee about Welsh Government's approach to borrowing. I look forward to having further discussions in committee tomorrow, where we'll look at capital funding. But, generally, we will always seek to use conventional capital first, including financial transactions capital, because that's the cheapest kind of capital, and then we will look to more innovative funding models, such as the mutual investment model. But I think it's important to take this opportunity, as we go into recess, to really set out the challenges and the seriousness of the situation that we are facing, with a view to having those discussions, both on the budget tour, where I'll be engaging with organisations, but also with fellow Assembly Members. And I'm really keen to know more about the work that the Finance Committee has been doing in its budget round-tables, to hear priorities from the people of Wales through that particular forum.

Thank you very much, Minister.

5. Statement by the Counsel General and Brexit Minister: Brexit Preparedness

Item 5 on the agenda is a statement by the Counsel General and Brexit Minister on Brexit preparedness—preparedness, preparedness—'preparedness' I think it is, isn't it? Yes. Sorry, I was having a minute there. So, can I call on the Counsel General and Brexit Minister, Jeremy Miles?

Jeremy Miles AC: Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. By next week, the Conservative Party leadership election will be over, and we will know the identity of the new Prime Minister. We have all watched a leadership campaign characterised by a race to see who can talk the toughest about a 'no deal', and a competition for the top job that focuses on the needs of the Conservative Party and not the needs of the country. It’s a debate that seems to forget that how the UK leaves the EU has a real world impact on people’s lives and livelihoods.
The expectation seems to be that, whoever the new Prime Minister is, he will be able to go to Brussels and renegotiate a deal in a matter of weeks. However, both Jeremy Hunt and Boris Johnson are ignoring the fact that the European Union has repeatedly said that they will not renegotiate the withdrawal agreement, and there is no magic technical solution available to ensure goods can move without friction on the island of Ireland.
They are also ignoring the fact that, for the EU, Brexit is a significant challenge but not an existential one. The EU-27 are preoccupied with the need to install a new European Commission and other top jobs and the development of a new five-year policy programme and seven-year budget.

Jeremy Miles AC: Yet again, Dirprwy Lywydd, we are back to chasing unicorns. We have a situation where appeasing grass-roots Tory supporters is taking precedence over the reality of the negotiations with the European Union. Gaining support of the hardline Brexiteers has been made the top priority, and not the national interest.
The dire consequence of all these factors is that crashing out of the EU without a deal becomes a very real possibility. By design or default, I fear that the next Conservative Prime Minister will take the UK towards a 'no deal' exit, and we have always said that this would be catastrophic for the UK as a whole, but particularly for Wales.And we are not alone in saying this. The list of businesses expressing grave concerns about leaving without a deal ought to be sobering. And more and more experts are highlighting the additional complexity that an October exit date creates. Let me pick out just a few examples for you. The chief executive of Tesco has said that leaving the European Union without a deal on 31 October could lead to problems with stocking shops, with less storage space for stockpiling, given the run-up to Christmas, than there was in March. As a result, he said it will be harder for retailers and manufacturers to build up stocks of goods, making the likelihood of empty shelves so much the greater.
The chief executive of Sainsbury's has warned that a 'no deal' Brexit on 31 October could significantly disrupt the supply of food, toys and electrical goods into the UK ahead of the festive period, saying that 'any hold-up at Britain's ports could be very disruptive to our business’. The National Farmers Union have said, frankly, it's worrying that 'no deal' is being put forward as a plausible scenario by policymakers and our leaders, and has warned that the mass slaughter of sheep may be the consequence. I wholeheartedly agree that 'no deal' should not be seen as a plausible scenario. The normalisation of 'no deal', the idea that it is a reasonable choice, in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, is extraordinary.
Make UK, which represents manufacturing and engineering firms, say that there is a direct link between politicians talking up the prospect of 'no deal', and British firms losing customers overseas and British people losing jobs in British firms.
In Wales, we have already seen the impact of this loss of confidence in the UK. Just within the automotive sector, we've seen the devastating job losses and closures announced of Schaeffer, Calsonic and Ford, while more than 2,000 Welsh supply chain jobs are at risk as a result of Honda’s decision to close its plant at Swindon. Continued Brexit uncertainty is damaging the economy right now.

Jeremy Miles AC: The Welsh Government and this National Assembly reject a 'no deal' exit. Any rational look at the hard facts of the implications of a 'no deal' exit shows that this will be catastrophic. During the referendum debate three years ago, 'no deal' was not put forward as a viable option. Access to the single market and seamless trade with the EU is what was promised by those backing 'leave'. There is simply no mandate for a 'no deal' exit. And canvassing the views of 160,000 members of the Conservative party is not a national mandate for leaving the European Union in a way that will trash the economy. We will not stand by and watch this happen.
The people now need to decide the way ahead. As agreed in this Chamber, we are calling for a second referendum to set a new mandate. All the evidence we have seen only reinforces our view that the UK remaining in the EU is in the best interests for the future prospects of everyone in the United Kingdom. As we did in 2016, we will campaign to remain in the European Union and we'll support all efforts to work on a cross-party basis to achieve that aim. Moreover, I want to be very clear that, should the incoming Prime Minister call a snap general election in a desperate effort to avoid Parliament preventing a 'no deal' Brexit and to seek a public mandate for such a disastrous course of action, we will do all that we can to persuade the UKLabour Party to adopt a manifesto commitment that an incoming Labour-led Government would cancel Brexit entirely.
Llywydd, faced as we are with the rising risk of a 'no deal' exit, we continue to work with partners to do all we can to prepare for the widespread and serious impact that a 'no deal' exit would cause. Since the extension was agreed in April, we have been taking the opportunity to review the 'no deal' preparations that we have made and to consider how best to build on all the valuable work done across the public sector and beyond to ensure our preparations are as robust as possible. In particular, this includes taking into account the additional complexities of an autumn 'no deal' exit that I have already mentioned. Further discussions—including next week at the Royal Welsh Show, for example—with relevant sectors will allow additional focus to be given to issues related to warehousing space, freight movement, and the haulage sector. It also means considering both the short-term and long-term impacts of a 'no deal' exit.
There remains great uncertainty over the likely impacts in the short term. Here, I fear that the hardline narrative, characterised by claims that the UK will renege on financial commitments, will only harden any response from the EU27. Many of the short-term consequences of a 'no deal' exit will be out of our direct control, and that is why our 'no deal' preparations need to be thorough and flexible to respond to the changing business climate. Drawing on our experience from March and April, we've been considering in particular how to support businesses and people to take further steps, where possible, to prepare for the potential implications of no deal. One of our key reflections from the spring preparations is that, where new operational systems would be put into place—for example, in relation to aspects related to the import and export of goods—businesses need to be aware of, and ready to use, those new arrangements. There is more that the UK Government, which has the primary responsibility for many of these systems at a UK level—there's more that they need to do in this regard, but equally we are determined to do what we can to support business in Wales.
My colleague the Minister for Economy and Transport has identified measures to support business through this difficult time. These include five simple, low-cost actions to help Welsh businesses prepare for a 'no deal' Brexit, and they are outlined on our website Paratoi Cymru. They cover the importance of importers and exporters obtaining an economic operator registration and identification number; those transferring personal data into the UK making sure that they continue to comply with GDPR regulations; those employing EU citizens encouraging staff to apply for them to remain in Wales through the EU settled status scheme; manufacturers checking regulatory requirements for UK and EU markets for labelling, approvals and testing; and all businesses visiting the Business Wales Brexit portal to assess how prepared they are and to get detailed expert advice. We are also focusing on maximising the capacity of the Development Bank of Wales to advise and support a much larger volume of businesses, with our actions being informed by as much intelligence as we can gather on potential sectoral and geographic vulnerabilities.
Alongside support for business, we're also focusing on support for people and communities, and on this theme we've recently announced a package of support to help EU citizens prepare for Brexit and continue to live and work in Wales. This will include support with applications and advice on social welfare issues and workplace rights through the network of Citizens Advice throughout Wales; an immigration advice service offering specialist support for complex cases, delivered by immigration legal specialists; increased provision of digital support centres in Wales to help those without the digital means to apply for settled status; and work with a range of charities and partners across Wales to raise awareness of the need to apply for settled status in hard-to-reach and vulnerable communities.
In addition, we've identified, alongside the UK Government, further legislative steps, by way of statutory instruments, that will be either necessary or desirable as a consequence of the extension to the article 50 timetable. I will be ensuring that Welsh Government preparations continue at pace over the summer so that we're in as strong a position as possible in October. This will include further announcements in due course on additional measures of support for people, communities and businesses through projects funded through our EU transition fund. But we will also continue to argue with all our might that a 'no deal' outcome and the damage it would cause to people’s lives and livelihoods would represent an unconscionable failure by the UK Government and must be avoided.
Llywydd, the new Prime Minister will face the same parliamentary arithmetic as Theresa May. There will continue to be deadlock in the Commons, and we're now almost certainly facing a straight choice between a 'no deal' or remaining in the European Union. The time has come to put the decision back to the people and the Welsh Government will campaign to remain in the European Union. It would be outrageous for any Government to take the UK out of the EU without a deal—as a deliberate act or as a result of inaction—without seeking a specific mandate to do so.

Darren Millar AC: Thank you, Minister, for your statement. I have to say that I thought it was all going to be on Brexit preparedness, but a good proportion of it, though, seemed to be more about the leadership contest in the Conservative Party. I also think it's a great shame that the Labour Party here in Wales have abandoned its previous position of respecting democracy. Prior to the vote in June 2016, your party made it absolutely clear that you would respect the outcome of that vote. Immediately after the vote, you said that you would respect the outcome of that vote. Your MPs—every single Labour MP in the House of Commons today—was elected on a manifesto that said that it would respect that result of the referendum. And yet, in the recent past, particularly the past few months, we've seen your party shapeshifting in an extraordinary way, not only calling for a second referendum, but going further than just calling for a second referendum, also then saying that you want to campaign to remain if a second referendum is held. And today, you've gone even further, because what you've said is that if there's going to be a snap general election, you simply want a manifesto commitment to cancel Brexit altogether. Well, how is that respecting democracy? You say there's no mandate to deliver Brexit, and yet we've had a referendum and we've had commitments in party manifestos from both of the main political parties that have said that they would deliver it. There's a mandate to deliver Brexit. There's certainly no mandate to cancel it, which is what you and your party want to do. I think it's ironic, frankly, that we're in that position.
You quoted a list of companies and organisations that are saying that they're concerned about a 'no deal' Brexit. Those same organisations told you and your party to back the Prime Minister's withdrawal deal. You didn't want to listen to them then, did you? That's the deal that's been negotiated with the EU. That's the deal that you say yourself has no prospect of being changed. So, therefore, the choice is between the withdrawal deal at the moment or no deal at all. And yet you still fail to back that particular deal. So, you can't have it all. You can't say that we are pushing, as a Conservative Party, the country into a 'no deal' Brexit position. Your party is what's pushed us closer to a 'no deal' Brexit position. That's the truth of the matter. Whether it's the NFU, whether it's Sainsbury's, Tesco, the society of motor manufacturers or Make UK, every single one of them supported the Prime Minister's withdrawal deal. You ignored them at that time and now you quote them selectively at the current time.
If I can ask a few questions on your statement. You made reference to the support that you're making available for businesses. Now, much of that support is only available, of course, via websites. You may not know this, of course, because not many of you have been in business, but businesspeople are extremely busy people. They have their businesses to run on a day-to-day basis. You cannot simply expect every small business person in the country to be seeking out information on Google in order to find your website somewhere on page 27 of the search results in order to get the advice that they might need. So, can I ask: what further steps are you taking to make sure that you are communicating with those small business people across Wales to make sure that they have the advice at their fingertips so that they know exactly what to do to prepare for 'no deal' Brexit, should that actually happen?
We know that one of the things that you've also put in place is the Brexit resilience fund, something that we welcome. Although it's a pretty meagre amount—less than £3 million, I think, altogether—in terms of the Brexit resilience fund, the slice that you've carved off for match funding for businesses to prepare for Brexit. Now, we know from answers in this Chamber on 10 July that that fund is oversubscribed. We know that there are more applications coming in than the Government is able to support. So, can you tell us exactly how many applications have come in, how many have been declined, and what you are doing in order to increase the capacity of that fund to support businesses to transition for all eventualities, including a 'no deal' Brexit?
Can you also tell us—? You've made mention of the fact that we need to be acting swiftly in order to prepare people for a Halloween Brexit, and yet the reality is that you're still sat on funds that you could be spending in order to help people prepare. You've said that you're going to make some more announcements over the summer. Well, whoopee-do, we'll be even closer to 31 October then, won't we? And people will not have the opportunity to be able to spend it properly in order that they can prepare. You need to be getting this cash out to people and getting this cash out to the public sector as well to prepare now, not waiting another few weeks so that you can catch some limelight over the summer recess period.
You made reference to legislative steps that might be necessary and you say that you've had some discussions with the UK Government about that, but you've not shed any light on what those legislative steps are or the timetable. I can see nothing at the moment on the future work timetable of this National Assembly to take forward any additional legislative steps, so perhaps you can tell us precisely what those legislative steps actually are, because I think it would be of interest to people who are watching this particular statement.
Can you also tell us, in terms of the EU transition fund, whether you're proposing to increase that? So, if we do end up in a situation where a 'no deal' Brexit is likely—and let me be clear, my party would rather have a deal that is good for the UK, good for Wales, and good for the EU—but if we're not going to be in that position because of the intransigence of the EU, then I would like to know what you're going to do in terms of that fund to increase its impact and to make sure that Wales is as best prepared as it possibly can be in all sectors—third sector, the public sector, and the private sector—so that we can make a success of whatever lies ahead.

Jeremy Miles AC: I thank the Member for that series of questions. It's his constant refrain that we need to respect the result of the 2016 referendum. He knows very well, of course, that on these benches we sought to find a version of Brexit that fulfilled the instruction in 2016 whilst minimising the damage to the Welsh economy. It was a version of Brexit that he and his party were not interested in in their headlong rush towards their ideologically driven version of Brexit. They showed no interest for the welfare of Welsh businesses, organisations and individuals that he claims to profess so much care for here today. Let me tell you what does not respect the result of the 2016 referendum is a 'no deal' Brexit, which no-one advocated for and people on those benches and others made a particular point of explaining to people how straightforward a deal would be. There is no mandate in the 2016 result for the course of action that he is perfectly prepared to tolerate in this Chamber today.
He asks what we are doing to support businesses. I take the point. I spent, I think, 20 years before being elected working in the private sector, so I absolutely understand, at least as much as anybody on those benches, what it's like to work for a business. And let me tell you, I absolutely understand, especially for small businesses, that there is not the capacity to spend time thinking and planning for all ranges of eventualities. That is a significant concern for us, and we are doing all we can through the Federation of Small Businesses and the through the chambers of commerce to try and communicate the resources that we are making available.
I will say to him that the Brexit resilience fund stands at considerably more than he gave in the figures there; we're looking at figures of approximately £9 million, and actually there is a lot of demand for that fund, absolutely, as we would expect to be the case. And we will keep under review the amount of funding that we are able to make available to support businesses, but we have provided—and I believe we may be the only Government in the UK that's done this—through the EU transition fund, a source of funding to support businesses and other organisations through the choppy waters that inevitably lie ahead for them.
Out of the £50 million fund, we've already committed a sum of around £35 million to £36 million. There are other proposals under consideration at the moment. He, I'm sure, will want to know that we are evaluating those proposals carefully in the interests of value for money and proper public accountability. And he is right to say that it is important for us to deploy those funds in as timely a way as possible. I point him to the announcement made by the Minister for finance, which she referred to in her statement a few moments ago, of the £85 million committed as a means of stimulating the economy to deal with the potentially damaging effects of the sort of Brexit that he and others are perfectly prepared to contemplate.
In relation to legislation, I mentioned in my statement that the legislation I was referring to was by way of statutory instruments. Obviously, the elongation of the period of our membership of the European Union means we're looking at other legislation passing through the European Union. We are looking to make corrections in statutory instruments and there are other improvements that we are needing to make to deal with the deferred point of departure. They will be dealt with in terms of scrutiny in accordance with the arrangements agreed with the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee and the Standing Orders of the Assembly.

Can I just gently remind speakers that we've had one question and a statement and we are halfway through the allocated time? So—[Interruption.] No, I'm not saying anybody, I'm just telling people that I have a number of speakers who wish to speak, so if we can just bear that in mind. Delyth Jewell.

Delyth Jewell AC: Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I wonder if we could take a moment to reflect on the regrettable and bizarre situation that we're in. We're talking about preparedness for various Brexit scenarios, every one of which will result in us being worse off than we are now. We are preparing simply to minimise the damage we inflict on ourselves.I welcome much of the Welsh Government's preparation, but it is a strange situation indeed, because preparing usually means planning for a specific event, but instead, Governments are forced to allocate resources to different scenarios knowing that some of it will be wasted.
The Minister talks about unicorns. It's fitting, because we seem to be in a topsy-turvy world, not just because we're preparing for something we can't foresee, but also because every decision taken by those in power in Westminster appears to be a proxy for something else. The referendum in 2016 was called as an attempt by David Cameron to placate the Eurosceptic wing of his party. People voted partly based on untruths, and now, the likely policy of the UK Government, be it under Boris Johnson or Jeremy Hunt, will be designed to appeal to the fewer than 160,000 Conservative Party members who will elect our next Prime Minister. Keeping the Conservative Party together has become a drama played out on the international stage. I might say, 'As flies to wanton Tories are we in this scenario, they play us for their sport', but I know my Shakespeare, and I don't think either candidate will turn out to be a reformed, benevolent Lear figure at the end of this contest.
As I've said, I welcome the steps that the Welsh Government is taking to prepare for a catastrophic 'no deal'—and it will be catastrophic—and I'd like to thank officials who are working so hard on this behind the scenes. Brexit has wasted unimaginable time, resource and opportunity. According to a recent report by S&P Global ratings, Brexit has cost the British economy £66 billion in just under three years. That's £1,000 per person—it hasn't happened yet—due to lack of growth that would otherwise have been expected, on top of funds directly spent on preparation. A topsy-turvy world indeed.
In respect of financial preparation for 'no deal', would the Minister update us on any progress in attempts to secure extra funding for Wales were 'no deal' unleashed upon us? How far have discussions reached and how much do you hope to secure? In terms of the time we've got left until the current Halloween exit date, would the Minister give his legal interpretation of what would happen were all relevant Brexit legislation not passed in time? If we find ourselves with an incoherent or gap-filled statute book, how will it affect this place's ability to function?
I'd like to welcome steps to support EU citizens. A constituent of mine who is an EU citizen has lived in the UK for the past 50 years, and is now very concerned since she let her non-UK passport lapse in the 1980s and is unable to pay for UK citizenship. Real people's lives are being turned upside down, day in, day out, by this uncertainty; anything we can do to help them is incredibly welcome. So, would the Minister please give a little detail about how the Government intends to reach out to those people to offer support?
Finally, Minister, you mention in your statement that if there is a snap general election,
'we will do all that we can to persuade the UK Labour Party'
to cancel Brexitentirely. Could you please clarify who 'we' are in this instance? Is that the Labour-Lib Dem coalition Government in Wales, or does this refer to Welsh Labour?UK Labour has made it clear they're in favour of a referendum, so long as they're not in a position to deliver it, and will deliver Brexit if they're in Government. So, if your efforts to change that position fail, will Welsh Labour stand on a different manifesto from UK Labour, and if so, could you countenance breaking away as a separate entity, so that your MPs can be subject to a different whip in Westminster, or will we have a situation where the Labour Welsh Government's policy is at odds with the Labour Party manifesto? I ask for clarity in these topsy-turvy times.

Jeremy Miles AC: I thank the Member for those questions. I'lltry and deal with them succinctly given the Dirprwy Llywydd's instruction. On the question of an emergency funding commitment from the UK Government, no commitment of particular sums of money has been made by the Treasury in that particular context. She will know that the Minister for finance has been very clear that in the circumstances in particular of a 'no deal' Brexit, we would be in a position where we would require significant additional support from the UK Government to compensate for that scenario and to fund the consequences of it. In relation to the UK Government's guarantee, for example, in relation to European funding streams, there is a concern that that is narrower than we had previously understood, and I think there also remain questions around the timing of its availability in some circumstances. So, there is not the clarity that either she or I or others in this Chamber would wish to see in relation to the UK Government's financial commitment in that particular context.
She asked about the progress of legislation. Certainly, with regard to the secondary legislation and the statutory instruments programme that we've been undertaking here for a very long time at this point, the purpose of that is to ensure that the Welsh statute book, if I can use that term, is capable of continuing in a 'no deal' scenario, having transposed EU law into our law here in Wales. As I've mentioned in the past, we have made great progress in relation to that and I'm content that the statute book would reflect the position of EU law at the point of exit.
On the question of primary legislation, of course, some of the Bills remain in different stages at the House of Commons at this point. Clearly, some of those Bills need to be passed in order for us to have certain powers, in particular in the field of agriculture, reflecting the discussion we had in the Chamber earlier today. As the First Minister said in his statement earlier, we will need to be alive to the possible implications of a hard or a 'no deal' Brexit and the effect that that may have of creating the need here for legislation that is currently unforeseen, to deal with some of those consequences.
In relation to—. I think she was asking me a question about support for EU citizens living here in Wales, or citizens born in other parts of the EU, I should say. There is a suite of support provided in relation to immigration law advice, a public awareness campaign to identify the rights of EU citizens who are entitled to settle here in Wales. There is also a package of support to understand a broader range of rights for EU citizens here in Wales, and also activity under way to seek to extend the number of digital assistance centres for those people not able, easily themselves, to make an online application. So, there is a range of different measures of support that we are making available.
In relation to her last point, I'm going to resist the temptation of discussing in detail the constitutional arrangements of my party. Suffice it to say, standing here as a Welsh Labour politician, I don't think I could have been clearer in our position.

David Rees AC: Can I thank the Minister for his statement this afternoon? It's very much appreciated. I know we've often said that we keep hearing it, but it is important we keep being updated, particularly in a world in which what was said yesterday may no longer be valid today, and it is very fluid—not quite topsy-turvy, but moving very fast, changing very quickly—and I also appreciate the fact that the comments made from the two candidates don't help that situation. Only yesterday, Boris Johnson was clearly saying that, in fact, he wants the backstop removed totally, so he's changed his position even on that now. Once it was 'renegotiate'; now it's 'get rid of', and we all know that the European Union has categorically said that's not going to happen, so we are heading for a 'no deal' scenario, and I think he's just trying to find an excuse to justify his 'no deal' scenario on 31 October. If that's the case, we need to prepare for it, because clearly there are some serious issues that Wales has to address on that matter.
I suppose I want to ask some of my questions focusing on literally that preparedness, because you highlighted in your statement very much the scenarios we are operating under, the context we're in, and then went on to move a little bit about some of the issues you've addressed. But can I talk about freight licences and heavy goods vehicle licences, for example? It's one of the areas we've talked about before. We have many logistics companies within Wales; there's a limited number of permits that will be available, and in a 'no deal' scenario, we could be facing a very challenging situation for those companies. What discussions have you had with the UK Government on the allocation of permits to Welsh companies, to ensure that they can operate if there is a 'no deal' scenario on 1 November? Also, what discussions have you had with the UK Government regarding the ports? Because, again, if that happens, we're going to be in a situation where we'll have to have border controls and regulatory controls on our ports, to look at the situations. Some of those responsibilities are not with the Welsh Government; they're with the UK Government. And yet ports, actually, is responsible under the Welsh Government, so what discussions are you having to make sure that we're in that position where we don't have to have a problem awaiting because simply it hasn't been thought of?
I will mention the legalities of it, because you mentioned, just now, obviously, the emergency legislation that may have to come through. Have you done any analysis as to what types and what areas you will be looking at? Because, you were saying we need to be aware of it, but it's not just being aware of it; we need to be ready for it. So, what areas are you actually looking at now, and are you looking at those areas so that when we come back after the summer recess, you'll be able to tell us exactly in which areas you think emergency legislation may be needed if we're in that situation?
Also, can you discuss the warehouses? We've been told—your statement highlights the point clearly—the warehousing issue is going to be contentious, because businesses want to continue operating under their normal regulation on business. That means they will want their warehouse spaces for their own businesses. We know that the Welsh Government looked at warehousing prior to the 29 March date. Where are we with, perhaps, refrigerated warehouses for medicines, if we need that? What's the situation for other warehousing, if we need that, because you're now in a competition with major organisations wanting warehouse space? So, again, have you made movements towards that area yet?
I also want to know if you have discussed any of these issues with EU officials and other nations and regions across the EU, because as a nation we have had many memorandums of understanding and agreements with other regions and nations, and we will want to work with those in the situation when we leave the EU without a deal. So, I started to have discussions with those nations to see where they can help us as well because they will be on, technically, the other side of the argument. Also, do you agree with me—I am tired, really tired, of Members continuing to say 'EU intransigence'—that it is not EU intransigence; it is the failure of this Government in Westminster to actually get to grips with the actual solution? It's time that they actually got that message out. It's not EU intransigence; it is Conservative incompetence that has got us into this position, and we need to make sure that that message is loud and clear across the nation, because they are the ones who are holding us back. The two leading candidates at the moment are two of the largest proponents today of that failure.

Minister.

Jeremy Miles AC: I thank David Rees for his questions. I will deal with them in turn. On the question of haulage and the permitting, we are in close contact, obviously, with the Road Haulage Association and the Freight Transport Association in relation to the issues that they will face, both here in Wales and also, of course, further afield. The impact of this felt across the UK could potentially impact the Welsh economy's haulage and freight routes across the border. We have been pressing the UK Government in relation to this. I know that he is aware that falling back on the international permitting system could place severe restrictions, in practical terms, on operators' capacity to move goods across the UK-EU border. He will know, I think, that the EU has agreed a temporary solution were we to leave without a deal, so that goods would continue to be capable of being moved across the border on the basis of mutual recognition, but that extends to the end of this calendar year. As I understand it today, that hasn't been extended to reflect a departure date in October, so we continue to work with key stakeholders around what response is required in relation to that.
On the question of ports, he will recall, I think, the statement that the Minister for Economy and Transport made in April in relation in particular to the arrangements that we've agreed around Holyhead to establish the additional capacity at the Road King site and, indeed, Parc Cybi. Those arrangements remain available in a later Brexit, and stand ready to be deployed, should they be needed. That isn't the current expectation, but they are there as a fallback should they be required.
On the question of warehouse capacity, in relation to food supply in particular, as he knows, I think, the UK Government is leading on the issue of food supply across the UK, though plainly we feed into that as a Government. They are looking at warehousing capacity in relation to cold storage and so forth. He will also know, I think, that the Welsh Government has made available funding for cold storage in Wales through the private sector. In addition to that, in a context other than food, we clearly now have the capacity in the warehouse that we have acquired in south Wales to enable us to store medical devices and social care devices, enabling us to stock items that we perhaps wouldn't feel the need to stock, in the context of ensuring supplies to the NHS and the care sector. But it's obviously an issue that has a different set of considerations at the point of departure in October than in the spring because of the pressure on warehousing due to pre-Christmas stock and so on.
On the question of emergency legislation, I will just reassure the Member that this is a matter that is kept continually under review by lawyers looking at the progress of legislation. But, clearly, as I know his question implies, it is not possible to be definitive on what, if anything, might be required until the basis of departure is known to us. But that is a situation that is kept under close review.
His last question, I think, related to engagement with our partners in the European Union in relation to this. He will know that the First Minister was in Brussels a few weeks ago, and there continued to be official-level contact with partners in the European Union, so that they understand the position of the Welsh Government on behalf of the people of Wales.

David J Rowlands AC: Well, thank you, Brexit Minister, for yet another Nostradamus statement with regard to Brexit. Whilst we in the Brexit Party understand that it is prudent to make preparations for every scenario with regard to our exit from the EU, including a 'no deal' Brexit, can it be said that those preparations are in fact prudent if they're based on wild predictions about a 'no deal' being a disastrous result, particularly for the Welsh economy? It appears that project fear is still being perpetrated with no real substance to the conclusions being drawn. Almost every piece of evidence instanced in your statement replicates the arguments used against us not taking up the euro. We all know how ludicrously false those predictions turned out to be. I note the comments with regard to the Tory Party appeasing their grass-roots members, but surely it can be said that Corbyn is equally obsessed with appeasing the fascist left of the Labour Party. You say there is no mandate for a 'no deal' Brexit. Well, we've just had a European election, and just in case you didn't understand, the name Brexit gives an idea as to what the party that won that election actually stands for, and we were very clear about the fact that we would countenance a 'no deal' Brexit.
Let's just look at some of the positive aspects of a 'no deal' scenario. A 'no deal' Brexit would mean that we do not pay the £39 billion now being contemplated. If there is a 'no deal', it would mean that this money could be used to subsidise our own industries, not those on the continent until such time as new, more lucrative markets are found. This would, of course, include our farming industry, and, in fact, subsidising the Welsh farming industry would be a tiny proportion of the total money saved from our not belonging to the Brussels debacle. You assert that job losses at Ford, Schaeffler and Calsonic are a result of uncertainty over Brexit, but that is an uncertainty spawned by remainers' refusal to accept the democratic vote of the British people. You of course conveniently forget the Bosch decision to move their plant from Miskin to Hungary, aided by European grants, with a resultant loss of 900 skilled, well-paid jobs.
We must remember that 95 per cent of Welsh businesses have nothing whatsoever to do with exporting, and an even smaller percentage involved in exporting to the EU, yet there is a considerable cost to every business complying with EU rules and regulations. Coming out of the EU could boost British and Welsh businesses by giving them greater freedoms to produce.
Perhaps we should consider the British fishing industry. At this very moment, there are 84 Dutch trawlers using the electronic stun fishing technique in what will be British waters after Brexit. This method of fishing is having a disastrous effect on crustacean and fish populations. It is said they're ignoring EU rules by claiming to be scientific vessels. In fact, British fishing grounds have been plundered by foreign vessels for close on half a century. So much for the oft-lauded European environmental legislation. Incidentally, our British trawlers are actually banned from fishing in the Mediterranean.
If we really are serious about preparing for a 'no deal' scenario, we should not be using it as a tool for promoting project fear. There may well be some downsides to leaving the EU, but all impartial economists predict this to be short term only. The UK has proved time and again that it has a hugely resilient economic base. We should not be afraid of Brexit, whichever form it takes. Better a 'no deal' scenario than that contemplated by some Members of this Assembly or, worse still, that envisaged by Theresa May.

I don't think I heard a question. I didn't hear a question from the Member. It is a statement and it was meant to have a lead-in and a question. I didn't hear any questions, I don't think.

Jeremy Miles AC: I believe he asked whether the Welsh Government's arrangements could be said to be prudent, to which the answer is 'yes'.

That's fine, thank you. Mark Isherwood.

Mark Isherwood AC: Diolch. Exports from Britain actually reached record highs in 2018 and have continued to rise since, totalling over £647 billion in the 12 months to May this year, with the fastest growing importers of UK goods predominantly non-European. The UK is still the top destination in Europe for foreign direct investment, and the third highest globally after the US and China. And, of course, in March, Mr Barnier, the European Union’s chief Brexit negotiator, said that, in all scenarios, respecting the Good Friday agreement meant preventing the return of a hard border between Ireland and Northern Ireland. We know that 75 per cent of Wales’s exports are estimated to go to the rest of the UK, and only 15 per cent to the EU. And when officials from the representation of the German state Bremen told the external affairs committee that 10 per cent to 15 per cent of the gross domestic product of Germany is to the UK, they put this as it’s exposed to the UK market. So, there’s a degree of equivalence between the risks of not coming to a deal on both sides of what, hopefully, will be a very close continuing friendship.
Yesterday, your colleague the economy Minister issued a statement on the impacts of Brexit on Wales's economy, referring to two quadrilateral groups established, with ministerial colleagues from the UK Government and other devolved administrations. One focused on business and industry, and he stated that the inaugural meeting on business and industry was positive. Well, there are ongoing preparatory talks between Westminster officials and EU officials so that the new Prime Minister can hit the ground running with an understanding from both sides where there might be flex between now and the end of October. That is happening. What positive engagement—in the spirit of Mr Skates’s statement yesterday—therefore is the Welsh Government having with that process, so that, at this preparatory stage, with the objective of getting a deal in the mutual interests of the economies on both sides of the water—? How is the Welsh Government engaging with that?

Jeremy Miles AC: Well, I thank the Member for his questions. I will just say, I simply do not share his optimistic outlook on the trade prospects for the UK outside the European Union—£3 out of every £4 earned by Welsh businesses from exports are earned by virtue of our membership of the European Union, and I think we throw that away at our peril, and much more importantly, at the peril of those business who look to us and look to Parliament to protect their interest.
He mentions the discussions in relation to future trade arrangements. He will, I think, recall that one of the points that we have pressed regularly with the UK Government is that the Welsh Government should be involved in preparing negotiating mandates for international negotiations. This is a practical step so that the UK’s negotiating positions command credibility, where they require implementation by the Welsh Government in Wales, but also it will be to respect the devolution boundary. And whilst it is the case that we have seen some progress in relation to that, we are very far short of the UK Government living up to that particular obligation that we seek from them, and I would urge him to do everything he can to seek to persuade his colleagues in Westminster of the virtue of our position.

Thank you very much.

6. The Landfill Disposals Tax (Wales) Act 2017 (Reliefs) (Miscellaneous Amendments) Regulations 2019

Item 6 on the agenda is the Landfill Disposals Tax (Wales) Act 2017 (Reliefs) (Miscellaneous Amendments) Regulations 2019, and I call on the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd to move the motion—Rebecca Evans.

Motion NDM7120 Rebecca Evans
To propose that the National Assembly for Wales; in accordance with Standing Order 27.5:
Approves that the draft The Landfill Disposals Tax (Wales) Act 2017 (Reliefs) (Miscellaneous Amendments) Regulations 2019 is made in accordance with the draftlaidin the Table Office on 25 June 2019.

Motion moved.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you. I'm pleased to present the Landfill Disposals Tax (Wales) Act 2017 (Reliefs) (Miscellaneous Amendments) Regulations 2019. I'd like to put on record my thanks to the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee for its work in considering these regulations. These regulations are made under sections 8(5)(b), 33(1)(b) and 94(1) of the Landfill Disposals Tax (Wales) Act 2017. The relate to amendments to the operation of site restoration relief and quarry relief. Regulation 2 will amend the definition of ‘restoration work’ to make it clear that restoration work carried out at a landfill disposal site that has not been capped is capable of being treated as restoration work for the purposes of the Act. A cap is a physical layer of protection that Natural Resources Wales, through its permitting requirements, will require a site to apply in order to contain and separate the waste from restoration work.
Since becoming operational in April 2018, the Welsh Revenue Authority has become aware that there may be landfill sites in Wales, known as inert sites, that Natural Resources Wales may not require to apply an engineered cap at the conclusion of disposal operations. This is because of the low environmental risk that the disposals made there pose. The result of the proposed amendment is that all landfill sites will become potentially eligible to claim site restoration relief, including inert landfill sites.
Regulation 3 will amend the relief for the refilling of opencast mines or quarries. The proposed amendment slightly broadens the extent of the relief to allow qualifying mixtures of material, other than fines, to be deposited, in addition to purely qualifying material. This recognises that, in many cases, a qualifying material may contain a small and incidental amount of non-qualifying material that is a low environmental risk. It ensures that the WRA is able to operate the relief in a practical and proportionate way, without eroding the clear parameters and underlying principles of this relief.
Although minor amendments, these regulations are an example of our responsiveness to operational practice. The amended regulations will help ensure that the relief for site restoration and refilling of quarries operate in a way that takes account of the social, economic and environmental context, and I ask Members to support these regulations.

Thank you. I call on the Chair of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee, Mick Antoniw.

Mick Antoniw AC: Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd. The committeeconsidered these regulations at its meeting on 8 July 2019 and we reported one merits point to the Assembly under Standing Order 21.3(i).Devolved taxes are paid into the Welsh consolidated fund, in accordance with the Tax Collection and Management (Wales) Act 2016, which states that the Welsh Revenue Authority must pay amounts collected in the exercise of its functions into the Welsh consolidated fund.
These regulations amend the reliefs available in respect of landfill disposals tax, and so may necessarily affect the tax receipts collected and paid into the Welsh consolidated fund. The explanatory memorandum does not provide an estimate of the reduction in tax receipts expected as a result of the changes made by these regulations.We raised this matter and, in its response to us, which we noted during our meeting, the Welsh Government said that any potential revenue impact as a result of these amendments is likely to be negligible.The Welsh Government also said that the amended legislation will align with the current HMRC position and, therefore, it would have minimal impact on revenue.Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd.

Thank you. I call on the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd to reply.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you. As the Chair of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee has said, it's not anticipated that either of these areas of amendment would have a significant impact on tax revenue. It is, however, hoped that the amendments would make the administration of landfill disposals tax easier and fairer, and therefore have a positive impact on the tax risk work of the WRA in these areas.
For the relief for refilling opencast mines and quarries, we don't anticipate this change benefiting any sites other than those currently claiming quarry relief. And this change is more to ensure legislation and practice are aligned in terms of the material going into the quarry. Our amended legislation will align with the current HMRC position, and therefore we'd expect a minimal impact on revenue.
And the change to the definition of 'site restoration work' will mean that inert sites in Wales may be able to claim site restoration relief, even if they do not have a cap. Many of those sites would have been able to claim quarry relief on most of the restoration work in any event, so this offsets the potential revenue impact.
I thank the committee for its work and, although simple, these regulations seek to ensure that the legislation is practically workable and gives a fair and consistent result to landfill site operators.

Thank you. The proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. Therefore, the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

7. The Allocation of Housing and Homelessness (Eligibility) (Wales) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 2019

Item 7 is the Allocation of Housing and Homelessness (Eligibility) (Wales) (Amendment) (No.2) Regulations 2019, and I call on the Minister for Housing and Local Government to move the motion—Julie James.

Motion NDM7121 Rebecca Evans
To propose that the National Assembly for Wales; in accordance with Standing Order 27.5:
Approves that the draft The Allocation of Housing and Homelessness (Eligibility) (Wales) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 2019 is made in accordance with the draft laid in the Table Office on 25 June 2019.

Motion moved.

Julie James AC: Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. I move the motion.
The European Union settlement scheme was introduced in January 2019 and became fully operational across the UK on 30 March 2019. The loophole created by the EU settlement scheme is relevant to individuals who are currently ineligible for housing assistance because they only have one of the rights to reside listed in regulation 6 of the current regulations, and who will obtain limited leave to remain under the EUSS. If such a person gains limited leave to remainunder the EU settlement scheme, he or she will have an additional right to reside, which will make them eligible for housing accommodation or housing assistance. This is not an intended consequence of the EUSS. An example of such a person would be a person from one of the nations within the European Economic Area whose only current right to reside is derived from his status as a jobseeker.
A person in that situation would not currently be entitled to housing assistance. However, if that person successfully applies for pre-settled status under the EU settlement scheme, they will have an additional right to reside in the UK.Under the regulations as currently drafted, that person would be entitled to an offer of housing assistance, and so gain an entitlement that they would not have had prior to the introduction of the EU settlement scheme.
People made eligible for housing assistance by virtue of the loophole created by the EUSS would not be entitled to housing benefit to pay their rent. This would mean that those individuals that are or become dependent on benefits to pay their rent might find themselves falling into rent arrears. The UK Government made this amendment to close this loophole in May this year.
In addition to that amendment, in July 2018 and November 2018 respectively, the UK Government extended eligibility for housing assistance to a specified number of unaccompanied refugee children from other countries in Europe, and those transferred from the Calais refugee camps. These amendment regulations also provide for this amendment in order to extend eligibility to those groups.
Closing the loophole will bring the Welsh Government in line with the other countries in the UK. Similar amendments to the same set of regulations are also required in relation to eligibility for allocation of housing. Powers to amend the provisions of the regulations to deal with eligibility for allocation of housing are contained in the Housing Act 1996. That Act provides that those amendments are to be made via the negative procedure.
These amendments were laid on 25 June and will come into force on 19 July, which is also the date that we intend these affirmative regulations to come into force. These amendments are technical in nature, and I want to assure Members that my officials will work with local authorities and other organisations to ensure they are aware of these changes.

I call on the Chair of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee, Mick Antoniw.

Mick Antoniw AC: Thank you. Again, we considered these regulations at our meeting on 8 July 2019. We noted that these regulations amend the provisions of the Allocation of Housing and Homelessness (Eligibility) (Wales) Regulations of 2014, the function of which is to prescribe the classes of persons subject to immigration control who are eligible for housing assistance under the Housing (Wales) Act of 2014, as well as the classes of persons from abroad not subject to immigration control, who are ineligible for housing assistance under that Act.
The effect of the amendment to regulation 5 of the 2014 regulations is to make specified unaccompanied refugee children who are entitled to relocation and support and specified people granted Calais leave to remain eligible for housing assistance, subject to some other conditions relating to residency.
The effect of the amendment to regulation 6 of the 2014 regulations is to maintain the status quo. Where specified persons with a right to reside in the UK, the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man or the Republic of Ireland are also granted limited leave to enter or remain in the UK pursuant to appendix EU of the immigration rules, under the European Union settlement scheme, this does not affect their eligibility. That is, they are not made eligible for housing assistance by virtue of having obtained limited leave to remain under the EUSS.
We did not report any issues to the Assembly under Standing Orders 21.2 or 21.3. However, whilst we acknowledge both that we aren’t a policy-specific committee in this matter, and that the regulations do not give effect to any Welsh Government policy changes, we felt it was necessary to take the opportunity to highlight the serious subject matters, such as this, which are often dealt with via subordinate legislation. Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd.

Thank you. I call on the Minister for Housing and Local Government to reply.

Julie James AC: Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer, and thank you to Mick Antoniw for those remarks.
It is important we ensure that those resettled in Wales under amendments to UK legislation are able to access housing and homelessness assistance if they need to do so, particularly where they have had to flee their home country and have been subject to the turmoil and stress of war and conflict.
With regard to EEA citizens granted leave to remain in the UK, there does need to be a distinction between those granted settled status and those granted pre-settled status, as there is now. These amendments ensure the distinction remains in place. I urge Members, therefore, to approve the regulations. Diolch.

Thank you. The proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. Therefore, the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

8. Legislative Consent Motion on the Non-Domestic Rating (Public Lavatories) Bill

Item 8 is the legislative consent motion on the Non-Domestic Rating (Public Lavatories) Bill, and I call on the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd to move the motion—Rebecca Evans.

Motion NDM7122 Rebecca Evans
To propose that the National Assembly for Wales, in accordance with Standing Order 29.6, agrees that provisions in the Non-Domestic Rating (Public Lavatories) Bill, insofar as they fall within the legislative competence of the National Assembly for Wales, should be considered by the UK Parliament.

Motion moved.

Rebecca Evans AC: Thank you. I welcome this opportunity to explain the background to this legislative consent motion. I'm grateful to the Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee for considering the LCMand for the report it has produced. The committee considers there is no impediment to the Assembly agreeing the LCM.The UK Government introduced the Non-Domestic Rating (Public Lavatories) Bill on 18 June.It's a short, single-purpose Bill,which will reduce the rates liability for stand-alone public toilets to zero from 1 April 2020.
The provisions apply to all stand-alone public toilets made available for public use, irrespective of who owns or operates the facilities. As this will contribute to our public health objectives in Wales, provisions for Wales were included in the Bill on introduction. I believe these provisions fall within the legislative competence of the National Assembly for Wales. However,as no suitable legislative vehicle is available to make these changes in Wales in time for implementation from April next year, I'm content that these provisions should be made in a Bill covering England and Wales. I therefore move the motion and ask the Assembly to approve it.

Thank you. I have no speakers. Therefore, the proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. Therefore, the motion is agreedin accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

9. Debate on Stage 4 of the Legislation (Wales) Bill

We now move to item 9, which is a debate on Stage 4 of the Legislation (Wales) Bill, and I call on the Counsel General and Brexit Minister,Jeremy Miles.

Motion NDM7123 Jeremy Miles
To propose that the National Assembly for Wales in accordance with Standing Order 26.47:
Approves the Legislation (Wales) Bill.

Motion moved.

Jeremy Miles AC: Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Although this is a technical Bill—it is law about the law—it's also an important Bill. The purpose of the Bill is to make Welsh law more accessible and to create legislation that is clear and consistent and which is also co-ordinated. It is a Bill that, on the one hand, looks to the future, a future where we will bring our long and complex statute book to order, creating a body of law that is clear, comprehensive, Welsh in both language and context.
And on the basis of Part 1 of the Bill, we will codify and consolidate legislation. This will allow the people of Wales to know where the law that applies to them exists and to understand what its impact is. It is also a Bill that puts rules in place that will enable legislation to be more succinct. These are rules not on the context of any legislation, but on the implementation of the legislation itself. These are rules that will be decided once so that they won't need to be considered again, unless necessary. It creates a regime that will apply to all pieces of legislation made in Wales after Part 2 of the Bill comes into force.
Following a similar theme, Part 3 also makes changes that will facilitate the process of creating subordinate legislation, and will enable us to insert clear dates in legislation once it has been passed, rather than the descriptions of dates that have had to be used before the legislation is passed. These are small but effective steps.
This Assembly has responded very positively to the Bill and has amended it in a constructive manner. I would like to thank you very much for that, and I would particularly like to thank members of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee, who have been so effective in scrutinising and proposing amendments to the Bill. I would also like to thank the Finance Committee for considering the financial implications.
I would like to also thank stakeholders who have contributed to the process. This has been a long journey, which started with the publication of a consultation document on the principles in June 2017, before we consulted on a draft Bill in March 2018. It has been a pleasure to discuss the Bill in Aberystwyth, Swansea, Bangor, Dublin and London, as well as here in Cardiff, of course. I would like to also recognise the contribution of those who were on the journey before I took post—the former Counsel Generals, Theo Huckle and Mick Antoniw.
Although the Welsh Government has led the way, and will continue to lead the way in this area, this is an issue that is important to us all, and we must all collaborate in order to develop an accessible, modern statute book for Wales. I am very proud, therefore, that the Bill has been supported across the Chamber, support that's been echoed by civil society here in Wales.
The work on codification of Welsh law is at its starting point. This will be a long journey with much to be done. But we cannot but make a start. The Bill is a signal of the maturity of our legislature, of the development of Welsh law, but also sets a foundation for the future. Thank you very much again for your support.

Suzy Davies AC: Can I just say 'thank you' to everyone involved in the preparation and the passage of this Bill through this place? And can I welcome particularly, again, the Counsel General's respect for the parliamentary process and his willingness to engage directly with Assembly Members, not just in committee but outside as well, and allowing us to have some visible influence over that process? In supporting the motion, our main point, Counsel General, at this stage, is to alert you to the forward look, to that future that you were talking about—those reviews of progress and our influence over those. And, again, I thank you for your letter to the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee on that. Inevitably, we will be looking at effectiveness and value for money, even looking back, perhaps, at some of those Finance Committee recommendations regarding resourcing and the financial implications of the Bill's objectives. And, of course, we will be looking at the public understanding and use of consolidated and codified law a little bit further down the line when it's had a chance to bed in.
I hope, Counsel General, you'll also take on board that accessibility includes accessibility for AMsand to consider perhaps better ways of bringing forward negative procedure secondary legislation to the attention of Assembly Members, bearing in mind that we are deemed to consent to that, so it's always good at least to be able to know it exists. Thank you.

The Counsel General to reply to the Bill, the debate.

Jeremy Miles AC: May I just thank Suzy Davies for her observations and her commitment to the ongoing project, for which the Bill is the foundation stone in many ways? So, thank you very much. Diolch yn fawr.

Thank you. So, in accordance with Standing Order 26.50C, a recorded vote must be taken on Stage 4 motions, and so I defer voting on this motion until voting time.

Voting deferred until voting time.

So, unless three Members wish for the bell to be rung, I think we've reached voting time. No. Right.

10. Voting Time

So, then, I call for vote on the motion tabled in the name of Jeremy Miles on Stage 4 of the Legislation (Wales) Bill. Open the vote. Close the vote. For the motion 49, no abstentions, none against. Therefore, Stage 4 of the Legislation (Wales) Bill has been passed.

NDM7123 - Debate on Stage 4 of the Legislation (Wales) Bill: For: 49, Against: 0, Abstain: 0
Motion has been agreedClick to see vote results

And that brings today's proceedings to a close. Thank you.

The meeting ended at 18:32.

QNR

Questions to the First Minister

Llyr Gruffydd: Will the First Minister make a statement on the Welsh Government's commitment to animal welfare?

Mark Drakeford: Animal welfare is a priority for the Welsh Government and the Wales animal health and welfare framework group. In Wales, we pride ourselves on having excellent animal welfare standards and expect everyone to be a responsible owner. We take animal welfare seriously and expect others to do so too.

Suzy Davies: Will the First Minister provide an update on the development of energy projects in South Wales West?

Mark Drakeford: Renewable energy is a critical part of the efficient and reliable low-carbon energy system that will support a prosperous low-carbon Wales. The Welsh Government continues to work with a range of partners across South Wales West to develop and deliver a strong and positive future for renewable energy.

Nick Ramsay: Will the First Minister provide an update on the Welsh Government's policies for improving the trunk road network?

Mark Drakeford: Transport links are vital to our economy and we are committed to ensuring a robust and well-maintained road network. Our priorities for improving the network are outlined in our national transport finance plan, which has been recently updated.

Rhianon Passmore: What action is the Welsh Government taking to aid the teaching profession in the delivery of the new curriculum?

Mark Drakeford: The feedback phase on curriculum for Wales 2022 closes this week. We are committed to ensuring all educational practitioners receive the support they need to deliver the new transformational curriculum, and a new national approach to professional learning is now in place to support this.